posted February 19, 2004 09:19 PM
sportrider magazine has zx10r hp #'s Read it for yourself. Go to sportrider.com where it says they tested the zx10r at 161.8hp and 80ft lbs of torque. They also state the 2003 GSXR1000 was at 152.1 and 78. This is GREATTTTTTTTTT news. As a comparison, the hayabusa I sold last summer had a Yosh pipe and a power commander and it dynoed at 163hp. Imagine being in the hp league of a hayabusa or zx12r and weighing about 75-100 lbs less? I'll never (well maybe sometimes) doubt the word of extremelean. He kept saying we would NOT be disappointed and it looks like he is right. Finally, it looks like Kawasaki is serious again. Now all I can say is: I still can't make up my mind between blue and orange. YESSSSSSSSSSSSSS
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Dan
04 ZX10r (Track only)
08 Concours14
posted February 19, 2004 09:48 PM
I'm still having trouble grasping this. By the time I do the same mods to the 10r (full pipe and power commander) as I did to the bus I'll probably be around 170 (?). That's 300cc less, 75-100 lbs less and approx 7 hp more. Isn't life good?
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Dan
04 ZX10r (Track only)
08 Concours14
posted February 19, 2004 10:30 PM
wow, nice smooth power delivery on that run too. i HATE flat spots (like the big ol one the 12 has). talkin about a peaky engine tho eh?
posted February 19, 2004 11:26 PM
Can't wait to see what Muzzy does with a pipe and power commander
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Dan
04 ZX10r (Track only)
08 Concours14
Needs a life
Full throttle!
Posts: One MEEEEEELLION
posted February 20, 2004 12:15 AM
Lest you guys think your 12 (or more) is gonna get waxed, pop up a 12R's torque curve and take a look at how much more torque you have at say, 5k rpm...
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82 Gpz750, 84 Ninja 900, 2000 ZX12R (Muzzy Big Bore Kit), *another* 2000 ZX12R (Muzzy custom stroke crank 1341cc motor), 2004 ZZR1200, 2005 ZX10R, 2007 ZX14, 2008 Concours 14, 2014 Versys 650, 2014 Yamaha WR450F, 2015 Ninja H2
posted February 20, 2004 01:47 AM
Correct me if I'm wrong swft. Unless both bikes are going to be pulling trailers I don't understand the torque issue on motorcycles. With the hp numbers both these bikes (10r and 12r) have they'll both be running in the 9's. If your comment on torque is correct then a hayabusa would smoke a 12r and we know that this is not true.
oh by the way, all I need is 4,950 more posts to catch you.......
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Dan
04 ZX10r (Track only)
08 Concours14
quote:Correct me if I'm wrong swft. Unless both bikes are going to be pulling trailers I don't understand the torque issue on motorcycles. With the hp numbers both these bikes (10r and 12r) have they'll both be running in the 9's. If your comment on torque is correct then a hayabusa would smoke a 12r and we know that this is not true.
oh by the way, all I need is 4,950 more posts to catch you.......
Needs a life
Full throttle!
Posts: One MEEEEEELLION
posted February 20, 2004 06:43 AM
Exactly. You can have a million horsepower, but torque is the physical force that actually moves you. A well tuned 1270 can have upwards of 105 - 108 lb/ft of torque, and a 1361 can exceed 120 lb/ft of torque. That's a huge amount more of tractive power over the output of a 1000cc motor. Horsepower is an arbitrary figure that correlates to 'how fast' something can be done, not how much it can do. Diesel pickups don't make big horsepower, but the torque numbers are what inform you how much it can pull up a hill.
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82 Gpz750, 84 Ninja 900, 2000 ZX12R (Muzzy Big Bore Kit), *another* 2000 ZX12R (Muzzy custom stroke crank 1341cc motor), 2004 ZZR1200, 2005 ZX10R, 2007 ZX14, 2008 Concours 14, 2014 Versys 650, 2014 Yamaha WR450F, 2015 Ninja H2
posted February 20, 2004 10:25 AM
Nice, but it would make a lot more sense to me at least, if they dynoed say the 12R along side, same for the Gixxer1K. As far as I know that dyno figure from the 1K is from last year.
Something to do with tolerances and so on.....
posted February 20, 2004 10:26 AM
personally i dont put much weight on torque numbers for bikes either. altho i often read your exact argument on torgue swft, i dont entirely buy it for one simple reason: gear ratios. but running slightly higher (lower? i always get it mixed up) gears, u get higher final drive torque right? ur just running the engine at slightly higher rpm. just like u drop a tooth in the front to get a little more kick at the cost of having to run the engine a touch faster and sacrificing a bti of top speed. i think torque is more a factor of how EASILY an engine can work, if that makes any sense. a little gas engine putting out 200ftlbs and 300hp could pull the same amount as a big diesel engine putting out 1000ftlbs and 300hp, but u'd have to rev the snot out of it and have a SUPER low first gear to get it off the line.
of course, it's quite possible i'm overlooking a crucial piece of the puzzle here and i'm totally wrong. anyoen care to correct me?
Needs a life
Full throttle!
Posts: One MEEEEEELLION
posted February 20, 2004 04:31 PM
Let's see if I can present an 'apples to apples' argument. I own a ZX12R and a ZZR1200. The ZX12R and ZZR1200 have almost identical gearing and are both turning around 3800 rpm at 60 mph. The ZZR makes much more torque at that RPM, and in a roll on up to 100mph will absolutely stomp the ZX12R. Now after that, the higher horsepower of the ZX12R will vault it past the ZZR and never look back. But the more torque you have, the easier you will get off the line.
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82 Gpz750, 84 Ninja 900, 2000 ZX12R (Muzzy Big Bore Kit), *another* 2000 ZX12R (Muzzy custom stroke crank 1341cc motor), 2004 ZZR1200, 2005 ZX10R, 2007 ZX14, 2008 Concours 14, 2014 Versys 650, 2014 Yamaha WR450F, 2015 Ninja H2
posted February 20, 2004 05:09 PM
If you listen the to the .wav file of the 10 on the dyno..I'd advise against using headphones...if you do, turn the volume down a bit. It's PFL.
Oh, I too am quite impressed by the numbers.
Good score, DB(the musical score of the 10 on the dyno is nice as well)
posted February 20, 2004 08:01 PM
swft, of course what you described makes perfect sense and is correct, but my point is u can increase the final drive torque on the 12 jsut by droppin a tooth up front (or however much u need to make up for the torque advantage of the zzr). then the 12 wins. of course, assuming an identical rev range the 112 will have to shift sooner which is a disadvantage, but at what point that disadvantage is overpowered by the torque/hp advantage i dont know.
posted February 20, 2004 08:11 PM
swft - roll on smoll on. I'm not buying a zx10r to do roll ons at 3000 or 5000 rpm. If I want to get from that rpm its clutch in, down shift a gear or two and drop the clutch with throttle wide open and front end lifted. If I wanted a bike to lug around town on and be lazy and not shift I'd kept my busa or as you said buy a ZZR, ELR ot 12r. Roll ons are NOT the mission of the 10r.
____________
Dan
04 ZX10r (Track only)
08 Concours14
Needs a life
Full throttle!
Posts: One MEEEEEELLION
posted February 20, 2004 08:29 PM
Hi DB - Umm...No prob with whatever you want to do with the 10r. I thin you intend on using a 10r for the same thing I do. Don't know why you think riding a 12 is lazy...Oh well, enjoy your bike when you get it! ____________
82 Gpz750, 84 Ninja 900, 2000 ZX12R (Muzzy Big Bore Kit), *another* 2000 ZX12R (Muzzy custom stroke crank 1341cc motor), 2004 ZZR1200, 2005 ZX10R, 2007 ZX14, 2008 Concours 14, 2014 Versys 650, 2014 Yamaha WR450F, 2015 Ninja H2
posted February 20, 2004 08:35 PM
hey swft, I'm not saying its lazy. I'm just saying that running these sportbikes through the gears is half the fun of them. I'm just saying that torque is not really a big factor on a 1000cc sportbike. No big deal. Hey, just remember bikes are all about the fun factor. LATER
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Dan
04 ZX10r (Track only)
08 Concours14
posted February 20, 2004 08:56 PM
Dyno #'s At last year's Cycle Barn Dyno Shootout, most of the GSXR's were in the mid 130s. Only 1 made it to the low 140's. A 1400 Busa w/Cams only made 183. In 3 years, I've yet to see any 12 w/full Muzzy exhaust make over 167. That's about 13 hp less than Muzzy advertises. What gives ???? I'll bet the new zx10rs won't do anything close to 161 @ Cyclebarn's next dyno shootout. I realize that the obvious answer is Cyclebarn has a stingy dyno, but everyone @ Cyclebarn from the Manager, mechs, and sales on down swear that dynojet has certified their dyno to be nuts on...
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We First make our habits and then our habits make us.
posted February 20, 2004 10:19 PM
Tourqe is like comparing women to men! Competely different! 1 is high strung sreaming fun! And the other is low GRUNT pull (on the wallet) !
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"Ya Gotta Have Big Ones!"
posted February 20, 2004 11:05 PM
megabyte, i'm betting the dyno used at the event is jsut not calculating numbers the same as the numbers we see in the mags. at SBW i'v seen a DJ 150 and a superflow used for the king of the hill contest. bother were right around 11% off the numbers everyone expected. not sure why teh DJ was off, but the superflow is expected to read aroudn 11% lower. just the way they measure/calculate it is different from advertised DJ numbers.
posted February 21, 2004 01:24 AM
Either way, 161.8 hp from a stock 1000cc bike that anyone can go and buy is totally awesome
____________
Dan
04 ZX10r (Track only)
08 Concours14
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posted February 19, 2004 09:19 PM
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