Bigbore4
Zone Head
Posts: 806
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posted March 14, 2011 04:25 PM
A bit of info on 2 ring pistons
In light of all the speculation about the single top ring pistons, primarily the CP stuff for the 12, I gave them a call.
There are no inherent issues with sealing or Plug fouling. The special composition top ring is more than able to deal with containing the gasses and the oil ring does a fine job from the bottom. The comp ring is some sort of nitrided composition.
They can provide a gapless ring for those that are worried, but the big thing is substantially less push/pull drag, to the tune of two to four HP per cylinder vs the conventional 2 comp ring setups. And that is on a stock motor, no mods, only comparing std ring piston with the single ring setup.
I'm not afraid of it and since I already have two complete cylinder/piston kits on the shelf, I'm gonna run em.
Everyone is always looking for the extra hp over the other guy. This looks like a good way to get it.
  
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KZScott
Needs a life
high on speed
Posts: 7235
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posted March 14, 2011 06:20 PM
avg 12 hp gain???
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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chavcat
Zone Head
Posts: 524
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posted March 14, 2011 06:25 PM
CP will make 3 ring 86mm pistons also
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Bigbore4
Zone Head
Posts: 806
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posted March 14, 2011 06:31 PM
Friction is friction. I'm sure there is a formula somewhere, although I can't remember it off the top a my head 
The CP rep didn't make any definate claims, but stated, "Typical gains, piston vs piston are 2 to 4 hp per cylinder. Stock motors, no other mods.
Obviously dependent on bore size, as ring area/friction is going to coincide with that.
I don't know a lot about CP, except for the fact that they are part of the Pankyl Group, which owns Carrillo also. They don't make any junk, that's for sure!
http://www.pankl.com/
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Bigbore4
Zone Head
Posts: 806
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posted March 14, 2011 06:34 PM
I'll give an honest update as soon as I have this thing back on the road.
I've got a 2 mil and a std bore kit with 13.5.
I'm curious just how much a guy can get from stock displacement with all the other mods.
On the other hand, I can go with the 2 mil and pretend it's stock
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WRECKSHOP
Expert Class
Posts: 359
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posted March 15, 2011 07:45 AM
Yeah CP makes some very, very good pistons and probably the BEST in the USA. And Pankl is the BEST in the WORLD when it comes down to pistons and rods and special parts !!!!
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted March 15, 2011 07:50 AM
 Edited By: Shane661 on 15 Mar 2011 15:56
There is probably a very good reason that the most street pistons use 3 rings. If not, why are most aftermarket also 3-ring in design, as well as the oem?
I really don't think there is is much "speculation" involved.
Shane
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Bigbore4
Zone Head
Posts: 806
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posted March 15, 2011 09:17 AM
You heard about a thing called progress? Technology does change and usually for the better.
I would bet money on the fact that theres probly not many if any on this board that are as sharp as the guys in white coats that design all this stuff.
Like I said, I've got two of these 2 ring kits settin on my bench and I'm sure gonna try them.
Heaven forbid if they actually make substantially more power, and who cares about a tiny bit of smoke out the pipe. It won't bother me although it might piss off the guy behind me, but he may be so far back it won't matter
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted March 15, 2011 09:23 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 15 Mar 2011 17:25
I don't think anyone is questioning whether they might make a little more power.
You're right, top engineers design these things. And for whatever reasons, they usually use 3 rings for a street application.
At any rate, I am certain that you will be happy with them. CP makes a fine product.
Shane
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Bigbore4
Zone Head
Posts: 806
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posted March 15, 2011 09:34 AM
Everyone wants a tight motor, but when it comes down to it, as long as it doesn't foul plugs or go through a quart every 500 miles, I'll be happy. It has to make more hp.
I'll be the guinea pig on this one.
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Shane661
Needs a life
Posts: 11494
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posted March 15, 2011 11:49 AM
These are the pistons for my ZX-14 stroker:
These are +2mm, 2-ring, and for a +5mm stroke. They will yield a static compression of around 14.5 - 15:1. As you can see, they are made by CP. They were purchased through Carpenter Racing.
Shane
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TRNorBRN6001
Needs a job
Posts: 2021
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posted March 15, 2011 06:59 PM
Very, Very Nice!!!!!
Go For It!!!!
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TFA 200MPH CLUB MEMBER!
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VincentHill
Needs a life
Posts: 6520
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posted March 16, 2011 11:30 AM
I had the very first set CP Made for a ZX12R and never a problem until I ran temps in the 16 to 1800 degree F and as lean as 18 to 1 on a 200 Shot of NOS. (Forgot to turn up the fuel pressure). Even with all of this, the valves had pieces cut out of them and holes into the cylinders but the pistons never broke. They make the very best pistons we can afford to buy.
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Made History @ Daytona and still one fast old man!!
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JOHNJ
Novice Class
Posts: 70
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posted March 16, 2011 05:36 PM
Very nice looking pistons for sure.....
But I was givin the option and givin the information that I was givin at the time about the 2 ring setup and possible oil usage/burning and I passed on the piston kit.....I was told about the possible 3 to 5 more hp but the I just couldn`t take the chance. I could just imagine my sprk. plugs trying to crap out on me or starting my bike and seeing it as a smoker just through me to the regulation 4 ring piston....
I hope you get the best perf. out of your motor for sure.....
Good luck....
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