2000redrocket
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Posts: 1662
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posted November 06, 2009 07:08 PM
my tuneing notes
for entertainment i will post my notes from logging and tuneing today to get close to what i want for the first time at the track. all are gotten 3rd gear with 17/50 gearing slight up grade .
the above picture is the stock ecu A-N map i put in map A location to start over. i wrote the afr at each enginuity location for a rpm fuel adjustment to tell what i want to do up or down.
the numbers to the right are me do ing math on rpms per sec to see if i am gaining a guicker rpm rise or going slower. the math is wrong on the upper that says 1306. it should be 606 rpms in .5 sec stock map was 524 in .5 sec do i win.
the above photo is the first up or down changes to try to get it close to 13.0 to 1 i got close first time. i am going to make some more tweeks on the 11600 to 12000 leaner to try to get it the same level as the lower from 8800 and up. then i am going to go richer shooting for 12.6. i will do this tonight so i do not have to do it tomorrow. the higher the rpms the bigger the number to get the same gain as a lower number in a lower rpm is always seems to me.and rich or lean seems to bleed onto higher rpm colums even though no map change.
this is the first time i charted it this way. i like it.
i went back to stock A-N map cause i got it imbalenced between cylinders on the changes. from time to time i do a compare and make sure all the cylinders have the same amount of up or down change. some times haveing to do things 4 times (one per cylinder) i get it goofed up some. must be bad fingers. those wanting to do this be carefull you make the changes you intend cause i get supprized sometimes. you could also. remember the number it was than see you went up or down x amount to verify the change. though starting over is not hard...
  
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KZScott
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posted November 07, 2009 08:27 AM
i think motec might be easier?
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01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted November 07, 2009 02:16 PM
i think from the feedback a mottys afr tuner has a more likeable way it tunes. but this keeps me busy. i am done. i have it where i want it for the track now and it is sort of close to flat.
my times were not real constant either. low 9.5s again.
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2000redrocket
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Posts: 1662
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posted November 07, 2009 05:25 PM
 Edited By: 2000redrocket on 8 Nov 2009 01:37
here is the end last map log. i tweeked it once while there. i need to get the lower rpms richer to match the rest.
i will work it richer for cecil next time.the air was aa of -150 in the morning then about 100 or less the rest of the day when it got warmer than 30 deg.
if you could slide the bar across you can see the same rpm 11500 for each gear go .1 richer as speed increases. RR says it is a fixed ram air map increase period on my ecu. i think i have access to the map but i have to fugure out which one it is. non i have that rr defind has numbers like he told me to look for. just intresting.
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted November 07, 2009 05:55 PM
map from 3rd gear roll ons friday to see the first log to the last log with one tweeking after two runs
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entropy
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Posts: 8671
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posted November 07, 2009 09:52 PM
200RR,
could you post a screen shot of the map you are modifying and talk a lil about how you modify it?
I am finding this topic of flashing more interesting by the minute.
thanks,
Karl
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2000redrocket
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posted November 08, 2009 09:54 AM
here you go Karl the first map is the top so one can see the colums rpm vs tps
second picture is of the bottom where i am usually.all the way over th the left is wide open. those are the numbers i change.
the third picture is a compair map to stock so the neg numbers will be how much lower my map2c is compaired to stock A1.
also to get rid of some of the over rich low area i took away fuel here also in the muzzy zone. i need to look at older maps and copy selection and past it in. i got it better but that is the hesitation down low also cause of all the fuel it dumps. i had it great i just need to copy that area.
karl i found that if you are close a 3 number change in the lower rpms is a good try. go 5 and i usually over shoot. if you want a .3 arf change try a lower number like the 2 or 3 number difference change. after a bit you will know what and how much. that afr line from the first try doing 3rd gear rollons from 2500rpms vs the first jpg of my final tweek and got the line fairly flat was one 10 min thinking and typeing session. i did find that on my logger chart i write down the afr for the rpm i have a number to adjust at like the note page i posted. trhen ir is faster to look and decide a number and not flip around screens a lot. plus you have hard notes on everything. just be carefull you make the change you intended to all 4 cylinders cause i have had to start over to balance the map 3 times over the course of 3 years. which is not that bad. i look at the number, make i grey, go up and put the number of the change in, push up or down arrow once, then go back down and see that it is either 4 higher or lower(you get my point) other wise i find sometimes i mess up or the program may cause a map paste should be a good copy paste but some times not so i copy the map and paste it twice than do a compair to see all "0" in the compair map.
hope this helps. RR should have pictures for you also on the flasher.
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entropy
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posted November 08, 2009 05:06 PM
2000RR,
thanks much for the info!!
this helps a lot!!
karl
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2000redrocket
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posted November 08, 2009 06:06 PM
by the way i ment to say all the way over bottom right is the area i mess with most. i think second gear has the lowest shift recovery rpm then the rest are over 10000. i am going to try to ritchen the lean area comming up through 1st but i may do a 2nd gear roll on over the bridge to let the bike at those rpm a longer time to try to help tuneing it.
do you like the top maps afr line though it could be richer it is flat mostly.
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rgeorge
Expert Class
Posts: 220
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posted November 08, 2009 08:27 PM
Redrocket, I had the same RPM spikes when I had my Wego connected to a coil wire. It got annoying so I switched to a injector, that worked better but dropped signal when throttle was closed. Now I log from the cam sensor and I get clean data all the time.
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted November 09, 2009 02:43 AM
thanks. i can see the lost rpm when on the injector at high rpm closed throttle.i may give it a try.
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entropy
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Posts: 8671
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posted November 09, 2009 03:49 AM
i downloaded a suzuki 750 powercommander map from some site in UK.
That map has cells which go to 14,500rpm, (fuel and adv) whereas my zx12 map only goes to 13000
then i put my latest map contents into that extended map
this morning i tried loading that extended map into my zx12 Y2K PC3r,
it wouldn't take it... incompatable...
hmmmmmmm....
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KZScott
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posted November 09, 2009 05:02 AM
did you try to load a .djm file or.map?
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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entropy
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Posts: 8671
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posted November 09, 2009 05:26 AM
quote:
did you try to load a .djm file or.map?
map.
it loaded the map with 13000 max cells, but choked on 14.5
I'll call Dynojet today unless someone here comes up wit a fix.
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KZScott
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posted November 09, 2009 05:56 AM
Edited By: KZScott on 9 Nov 2009 14:01
do you really need to? the ecu is only seeing 12700 right? and the pc should only impact numbers in that area(which due to the crystal are actually around 13300) im thinking the ecu would never use pc values above 13000 anyway
heres an expirement, add 20% to say 12000rpm in the pc, im guessing because of the crystal its going to show the rich spot around 12600 actual
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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rgeorge
Expert Class
Posts: 220
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posted November 09, 2009 10:21 AM
Edited By: rgeorge on 9 Nov 2009 18:34
Nope, the PC intercepts the signal from the ECU and modifies it before it gets to the injectors. The crystal mod makes the ECU think everything is happening slower than reality. The PC has its own internal clock, so it operates normally.
Karl I would expect the PC to do the same % adjustment as the max cell even when you are beyond max. Do you think you will need a significant difference between the 13000 13250 and 13500 cells?
Let us know what the PC customer support tells you.
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entropy
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posted November 09, 2009 10:44 AM
Edited By: entropy on 9 Nov 2009 18:46
Rob,
I don't think changes will be huge after 13000, but darn it! I want the ability to fiddle! 
i just taked to Chris at Dynojet and he said he'll email me a zero map which goes to 13500, and it "will load" in my Y2k ZX12's PC3r,
hmmmm...
can it be that simple? just call Dynojet?
to be continued
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entropy
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posted November 09, 2009 12:20 PM
Edited By: entropy on 10 Nov 2009 06:47
Dusty from Dynojet said no problem, sent me a zero map to 14000.
tonight i'll see if it works
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KZScott
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Posts: 7235
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posted November 09, 2009 12:34 PM
something tells me that smiley didnt go to plan lol
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
CMG Racing RCC Turbos
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted November 10, 2009 12:46 AM
Edited By: entropy on 10 Nov 2009 08:47
quote:
Dusty from Dynojet said no problem, sent me a zero map to 14000.
tonight i'll see if it works
Dusty's "tweaked to 14000 map" loaded fine 
Scott, you were right, finger was not the plan.
now all i need is ECU with uber-limiter, planned to arrive thu or fri :feengerscrossed
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted November 13, 2009 04:35 PM
today i did a 3rd gear blast at 60 degF. the bike from the air at the track vs today went from 13.2ish to 12.8 at my area. track temp was low 50s. intreasing. i would of thought it would of been the same.
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