TurboBlew

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BUSY DOING THE SCHIAVO
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posted November 20, 2006 08:21 PM
Sour grapes Muzzy story
Found this on another board.... mildly entertaining to say the least.
quote: I just got out of a lawsuit today with Rob Muzzy/Muzzys motorcycle concerning false advertising/fraud on the behalf of both himself, his sales team, and claims made on the company's website.
I ride a 2003 Kawi Z1000 and purchased a big-bore kit from Muzzy per his salesman's (Dave) reccomendation and glowing review of gobs more power, etc.
The kit went on like clockwork, was installed by a dealer, and worked great - except that it made no more power. The bike simply ran as it did before, less sounding a bit different and after re-mapping, using more fuel.
I thought it might just be me not riding it for awhile and that's why it wasn't feeling any faster, so I brought it to EDR performance just in case to get a second dyno run done to confirm/deny any suspicions. It ran a 130HP run, 1hp more than it was before the kit was installed, and the power curves/torque were nearly identical. It was like I had just spent $1,300 and nothing changed, so I figured something must be wrong!!
I went back to the dealer with the dyno charts and requested they do leakdown/timing/valve seat/compression tests to try to determine the problem. Everything checked out fine! There was no problem, other than that I got jacked by Muzzy's sales team and the kit didn't perform - at all.
I called Muzzys on it and they requested I bring my bike out to Bend to have their techs look at it. I did, and when I got it back they said they'd installed an airbox mod (NOT part of the kit) and that the bike was making great power. I brought it to EDR and their dyno confirmed a 4hp increase due to the mod. 4hp. For $1,300, one month, and Two trips to Bend from Hillsboro? F*ck no. So I took Rob Muzzy to small claims court to try to find justice because the company basically said I should be happy they gave me a billet airbox lid for free, and to shut my mouth. Well I'm not the type.
After taking Rob Muzzy to small claims court (yes, he actually showed up here in Hillsboro, twice, he kind of looks like Colnel Sanders actually...) and having him compare HIS dyno charts to the ones at EDR (which should have been the ONLY ones considered, being an "apples to apples" comparison) the judge that had absolutely no technical aptitude determined that I had received my money's worth because Robs numbers were big, mine were small, and therefore dismissed the case.
First of all, Rob Muzzy and his company use a different correction factor to get a higher number. Second, they had modified my airbox which was not part of the kit. Third, they didnt have the baseline on which to judge the performance of the kit, EDR did, so their dyno (pre, and post-kit) is the only one of relevance.
The judge did not understand this but I hope EVERYONE on sportbikes.ws does, and can understand a shitty company when they see one, and will not support Muzzys. We have plenty of options when it comes to aftermarket parts and Muzzy's is forever off my list. I hope losing the next 45 years of business from me, my friends, EDR and Hillsboro Motosport was worth $1,200 to Rob Muzzy. He lied through his teeth in court and all I wanted was a marginal performance increase as promised, or my money back. Not very impressive and I expected much more from such a big, well respected name in the motorcycle industry.
Feel free to repost this as you see fit and pass along any questions to me about any/all of it ~ Dave Taylor viewsoni@verizon.net
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Robmuzzy
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posted November 21, 2006 07:29 AM
This case was already tried in court 2 1/5 hrs worth. The judge found in favor of MUZZYS. I made every effort to explain to Mr. Taylor that his Z-1000 was not going to perform like a ZX-9 with a big bore kit. He did not believe me and took the matter to the court. The judge ruled that he failed to make his case.
*The mechanic that installed the kit stated that the performance was much improved.
*In his testimony Eric from EDR stated that he uses Std corrected hp, same as MUZZYS.
*In his testimony Mr. Taylor stated that there were no improvements in power including the
air box cover.
*Who is lying now?
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TRNorBRN6001
Needs a job
Posts: 2021
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posted November 21, 2006 08:44 AM
Sounds like Mr. Taylor is going to have a hard life ahead of him.
Glad you went to court instead of just giving up or settling with Mr. Taylor.
____________
TFA 200MPH CLUB MEMBER!
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GUNNER

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posted November 21, 2006 09:17 AM
quote:
*Who is lying now?
Rob,
Could this question be extended to women Because I can make a long list on that one
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TurboBlew

Moderator
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posted November 21, 2006 12:04 PM
Sorry Mr Muzzy.... Im kinda biased towards your side in this case.
Hence my sour grapes assessment.
____________
Official Charter Member of the RIDERS OF KAWASAKI MEMBERSHIP REVOCATION CLUB
Also a BadAss Internet Forum Moderator 4 Hire!! Come at me brah!
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NOX
Needs a job
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Posts: 3745
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posted November 21, 2006 12:27 PM
I have not been happy with Muzzy's in the past, BUT, how can anyone assume that a z1000 is going to make the same HP as a zx9 with a big bore, with milder cams than the zx9 in the 1000. Thats like assuming a bandit 1200 is going to make gsxr1100 power..........WTF? Its a total package..........
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frEEk

Administrator
ummm... yeah
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posted November 21, 2006 01:30 PM
i am curious about one thing:
quote: It ran a 130HP run, 1hp more than it was before the kit was installed, and the power curves/torque were nearly identical
this statement must have been incorrect or innaccurate/misleading, but exactly how so? did he not really have a baseline run? or was the baseline run on a different dyno?certainly doesn't agree with the mechanic that said performance was improved.
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NOX
Needs a job
PMRA / TMRC Super Street 4022
Posts: 3745
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posted November 21, 2006 03:36 PM
I think he was expecting zx9 numbers .........READ.......different cams!!!!!!!!!
____________
42 Wins
21 Runner-ups
2010 TMRC Super Street Points Champion
2010 PMRA Super Street #3 Points
2009 PMRA Super Street Points Runner-Up
6 Time Centerville Dragway Points Champion
Sponsored by:
Scorpion Helmets
Galfer Braking
AMSOIL
Steve's Speed Shop
Kawasaki Sports Center
Mickey Thompson Tires
Catalyst Racing Composites
Conway Cycle
Syed Leathers
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lonniemac
Expert Class
Posts: 225
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posted November 24, 2006 12:32 AM
Edited By: lonniemac on 24 Nov 2006 00:38
I was a 1270 and cams, and now i have a Muzzy 1317 big block kit and head work.. when i had the tunning done i was a little disappointed. the # were were almost the same as with the 1270. the tunner had to make changes every pass as the motor broke in more. when we stopped we about 2 hp more than the 1270. then i was upset. same dyno same tunner. so now i go to the track and the disappointment went with the first pass off the trailer. it was .15 faster in the 1/8th and 4 mph. as it boke in i started spraying, now its running 8mph and .18 faster than spray before. cubic inches does change things whether a dyno say so or not.
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VincentHill

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posted November 24, 2006 04:25 AM
quote: I was a 1270 and cams, and now i have a Muzzy 1317 big block kit and head work.. when i had the tunning done i was a little disappointed. the # were were almost the same as with the 1270. the tunner had to make changes every pass as the motor broke in more. when we stopped we about 2 hp more than the 1270. then i was upset. same dyno same tunner. so now i go to the track and the disappointment went with the first pass off the trailer. it was .15 faster in the 1/8th and 4 mph. as it boke in i started spraying, now its running 8mph and .18 faster than spray before. cubic inches does change things whether a dyno say so or not.
You Never said what the 1270 "Numbers" Were for HP & Torque. Torque is a Very Important Number also
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lonniemac
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Posts: 225
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posted November 24, 2006 02:56 PM
196 hp with 98 ft lbs. with the 1270 and 198 hp with 101 ftlbs on the 1317. i was looking to be over 200 but it wasnt then. it probably is now that it broken in . it was making hp on every run. i didnt want to hammer on it all day so we stopped and then added a little for breakin and let it go. im adding a sidewinder and a couple of other things and then back to the dyno.now that it should be broken in. i just want it tuned cause i am happy with its performance.
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VincentHill

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posted November 24, 2006 03:43 PM
That HAS to be STD Numbers. The 1317 look about right, but the numbers for the 1270 are not to be believed (I believe "You" but even STD I have never seen those numbers. Usually about 178 to 182 SAE (187 to 190 STD Max). The Torque was low both times so maybe it is just a matter of the Cam timing on YOUR Bike.
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lonniemac
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Posts: 225
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posted November 25, 2006 02:02 PM
Yea Vince i had cams in and also a lot of other things to contribute. the 1270 was very good. the tuner swore i had head work.i did port match everthing myself with a light cleanup.the valves were never removed. i spoke briefly with you in gainsville a few yrs back when Bear was there. He was a contributer to those #s as well. i havent changed the degree at all. i went with the # given by the cam company. changing cam settings is a job on the 12. i could use more tq. my 60ft should be better.I would still be running the 1270 now if it had not droped a valve. The 1270 was unbelievable. The only thing that concerns me adout the new setup is the offset cylinder. the good part is i do all my own assembly.
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lonniemac
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Posts: 225
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posted November 25, 2006 02:11 PM
Guys i know some people have had issues with Muzzy. But for me i have had very good service out of their parts. There is not a lot of r&d out there for the kaws. I have been to the track soo many times and was the only 12 among 10 busas and beat them. With muzzy stuff. to be the underdog at every race and come out winning a lot is a good feeling against the big busa guys. i have beat very large busa motors with the 1270 so much they swore i sprayed them.
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