aliveagain
Needs a life
Posts: 5033
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posted April 09, 2005 11:56 AM
uh oh
Finally made my first pass of the season and with the nitrous(40 shot)and swingarm extensions.That nitrous is wild!I spun in 2nd and 3rd.Trouble is, I'm hearing a rattling noise in the motor now.I got no more money to fix it so I may try it myself.Just how much does a 12 motor weigh?Is it something I would be able to pick up by myself to put on the bench?The motor didn't smoke, nor did the oil light come on.
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I wondered why the baseball kept getting bigger. Then it hit me.
  
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ninja12
Needs a job
Posts: 3310
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posted April 09, 2005 02:15 PM
did you hit the rev limiter on spray? Is it missing or running rough, could be
a spit shim. no need to go into the bottom if the top end is hurt.
do you have gold in your oil pan.
My guess is around 175 lbs.
not bad once you get it off the ground.
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MadMike
Moderator
FEAR THE BLACK FLAG!!!!!!!!
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posted April 09, 2005 02:47 PM
check the oil pan first. and NO you can not lift the motor by yourself... unless your He-Man...
dont start it again untill you figure it out! if you did spit a shim and bend a valve no need to do any more damage! drain your Oil, then if you have ANY metal material in your pan Drop the pan and look good for Bearing material or parts. If not check your clutch make sure you did not break your basket. and then if it is ok. Pull your Head off and find the bent valve!
Mad Mike
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aliveagain
Needs a life
Posts: 5033
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posted April 09, 2005 03:04 PM
Can I run the bike without any coolant ?The radiator is off so I don't know if that will stop the ECU from starting the bike.I was taking the Ti-Force header off and a ring fell down.It goes on one of the down tubes and wanted to try to see if the pipe had loosened up(nevr-sieze)causing the noise.Tough call.I don't think I hit the rev limiter,but I did spin so who knows.
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I wondered why the baseball kept getting bigger. Then it hit me.
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aliveagain
Needs a life
Posts: 5033
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posted April 09, 2005 03:34 PM
Bingo! tightened header back up and no noise.PHEW! I looked in the exhaust port and the one with the loose cap was a couple of shades cleaner.
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I wondered why the baseball kept getting bigger. Then it hit me.
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aliveagain
Needs a life
Posts: 5033
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posted April 09, 2005 04:24 PM
Balls! Radiator back on,coolant filled and warming it up to burp the air out and I can hear a ticking noise.Not loud but still there.I'm not going to chance it.Oil looked good.Next step ,I'm going to pull the valve cover.
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I wondered why the baseball kept getting bigger. Then it hit me.
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VincentHill
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Posts: 6520
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posted April 09, 2005 05:21 PM
Nothing is worse than what you are going through! Keep remembering one thing, it all can be fixed! (Sooner or later)
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Made History @ Daytona and still one fast old man!!
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aliveagain
Needs a life
Posts: 5033
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posted April 09, 2005 06:30 PM
Well,I pulled the cams and looked at the shims and keepers, all in place.Now I need help.I admit I don't know jack shit about motors.I suppose I could pull the head off but why?The valves are all in place and the motor doesn't smoke.I need some advice as to what to do next.I'm done working on it for the night,so I hope I'll get some feedback.Thanx in advance.
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I wondered why the baseball kept getting bigger. Then it hit me.
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CrotchRocket
Moderator
Bracket Racing with Betsy
Posts: 8038
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posted April 09, 2005 08:56 PM
maybe you should put all new exhaust gaskets in, start her up and see if its still ticking before you do anything else!!!
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Jason Miller StreetBike Seminars
*****DragRacers do it better, because they dont cut Corners*****
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MadMike
Moderator
FEAR THE BLACK FLAG!!!!!!!!
Posts: 6579
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posted April 09, 2005 09:09 PM
I agree, did you pull your clutch cover? do you have a billet basket?
also check your valve clearance. that will tell you if something is weird with the valves.
so you pulled the buckets off of the valves to check every shim?
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BA
Pro
Posts: 1592
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posted April 09, 2005 09:30 PM
(I fucking hate that my PC doesn't log me in automatically anymore...it is so f'n annoying to write a reply and then lose it.....)
a flat-tip screw driver or something similar can help you determine the location of a tick sometimes.
ie. put the flat tip on the valve cover, the other end at your ear. yes. your ear. Then move it to the lower part of the block and the clutch basket if you choose. heck, each exhaust pipe if you have a long enough screwdriver.
it's been known to help.
You can also put your ear at the ram air intake to see if it sounds loud there.
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted April 09, 2005 11:01 PM
quote:
Drop the pan and look good for Bearing material or parts.
Mad Mike
have you done this?
looked in the oil pickup screen?
I've oil looking great when I drained it, but there were bits evident when the pan came off.
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
Posts: 9660
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posted April 09, 2005 11:02 PM
BA, assuming you come to this site as bikeland.org, go to http://www.bikeland.org/board/cookieclear.php and http://bikeland.org/board/cookieclear.php then login fresh. that usually fixes the problem with it not logging u in automatically.
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aliveagain
Needs a life
Posts: 5033
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posted April 10, 2005 01:14 AM
MM,what would you have me check if I pulled the clutch cover?I do have a billet basket.I pulled each bucket out with a magnet one at a time to not get the shims mixed.Are there ever more then one shim under the bucket?Haven't a clue as to how to get the cams back in,should be fun.I didn't check any of the clearances.I like the idea with the oil pan removal.I had been thinking about whether the bearings might have loosened up enough to allow a valve to kiss.Been thinking about blocking up the motor,remove the front engine mount and pull the head and check the tops of the pistons.Should I try to buy the head gasket already bored(1320 SBM) or a stock one and have it cut?And yes I do have a manual.BA, right in the middle of what I had written,I went back to see what you posted.I then clicked on to the link and to my horror found it erased what I'ld written.Too early in the morning.
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I wondered why the baseball kept getting bigger. Then it hit me.
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ninja12
Needs a job
Posts: 3310
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posted April 10, 2005 06:41 AM
The injector have a light tick.
What really make it worst is when you THINK you have a problem. (scared)
If you have the cams out , might as well give the girl a good once over.
pull the pipe and pan. Do you have a leak-down tester with 10mm adapter?
If you can get one quick i would do this first. Best tool i know to identify topend problems
The stock baskets have been know to crack probably why Mike asked.
Mike you don't have to be a he-man, just a need-man.
5'10" @ 200 lb winter weight, i have removed, serviced and replaced several
zx12 motors by myself . Man got to do what a mans got to do.
IF i had help available i would definately use it.
http://secure.cartsvr.net/catalogs/catalog.asp?prodid=328268&showprevnext=1
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osti33
Needs a job
Posts: 2973
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posted April 10, 2005 07:34 AM
Sounds like an exhaust leak to me. If the valve train all looks good and the oil looks fine I would put it all back together with NEW exhaust gaskets and see if your tick goes away.
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ninja12
Needs a job
Posts: 3310
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posted April 10, 2005 08:17 AM
Osti, hopefully you're right.
BUT a couple hour of checking now could pay big dividends if your wrong.
This is especially true of a race engine, and more so with nitrous.
bend valve ~$300 ......~200 set form Madmike ~100 head gasket.
rod damage ~$600 ....~250 crank repair , 100 rod, 100 rod bolts nuts, 100 head gasket , 50 bearins and etc.
That's normal repair if it's caught early
I lost a entire engine on spray last year. I WISH I HAD HEARD A TICKING!
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aliveagain
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Posts: 5033
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posted April 10, 2005 10:52 AM
Well the screen is all clear.the head is unbolted but the throttle bodies are kicking my butt.It would be alot easier without that oil tube in there.The manual doesn't mention that until installation.I'm going to need a 3mm allen socket to get the boot clamps off.They're all facing the same way.I'm going to flip 2 of them over for easier acess next time.I'm stiff and tired so I'll take a break to keep my sanity.
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I wondered why the baseball kept getting bigger. Then it hit me.
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted April 10, 2005 11:13 AM
you DID pull the oil pan, eh? the screen you are talking about is the oil screen in the pickup?
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VincentHill
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posted April 10, 2005 12:23 PM
I did the same thing with my Throttle Body clamps. Just take your time and install the cams. Remember the maeks are going to be about 1/4 inch above the machined surface (BEFORE YOU SCREW DOWM THE BEARING PLATE and torque it into place) look at all of the Marks and count the nymber of pins between the the cam marks twice. Once everything is in place, then slowly turn the engine over with a wrench. (Make sure the Can tensioner is in and the Spark plugs are all out. If you can turn the engine over a few times and then end up with the mark on the Rotor at the Split in the cases and both cams are in the correct place you are OK.
YOU ALWAYS CHECK THE CLEARANCE OF THE VALVES BEFORE YOU REMOVE THE CAMS . THIS LETS YOU KNOW IF ANY ARE OFF / LOOSE (AND THE POSSIBLE CAUSE OF THE TICKING
When finish with this, check the compression. If you find a cylinder down / low, then you know where the problem is! Always do the measuring and checking before taking major things apart.
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Made History @ Daytona and still one fast old man!!
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aliveagain
Needs a life
Posts: 5033
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posted April 10, 2005 01:41 PM
Well I finally got the motor to tilt forward.Hoses and cable under the throttle bodies were fun,not!I better not get a flat because my truck jack is holding up the front of the motor.No marks on the valves or pistons but I saw something that bothers me.About 2 1/2" of a middle cylinder has not a scuff mark but it wore away the hone marks.This is a Superbike Mike cylinder with offset pistons.Do I need to worry about it?As a reminder to anyone considering going this far,I took a bunch of cardboard boxes and spread them on the garage floor. Makes for a neat place to put down all the parts.My other question is whether Muzzy's and SBM blocks use the same gasket.They may be the same size pistons but I'm not sure the offset is the same.
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I wondered why the baseball kept getting bigger. Then it hit me.
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted April 10, 2005 02:34 PM
the SBM and Muzzy blocks do NOT use the same gaskets. Muzzy is offset, SBM is not.
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MadMike
Moderator
FEAR THE BLACK FLAG!!!!!!!!
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posted April 10, 2005 02:40 PM
take a few pictures.... if you can doesent sound like the wear is much of a problem. oh where is the scuff? can you rotate the motor with out any issues? keep it coming... I believe your doing everything just fine!
Mad Mike
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200-MPH CLUB MEMBER!
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johnnycheese
Pro
Posts: 1008
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posted April 10, 2005 03:35 PM
I have the head gaskets.
pull the wrist pins and look at them
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Builder and tuner of some of the fastest N.A. and P/A Hayabusas and ZX12 /14 in Texas
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aliveagain
Needs a life
Posts: 5033
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posted April 11, 2005 02:10 PM
I don't know where to go from here.I pulled the cylinder off and the #3 piston,above the top ring,was grinding against the wall.I feel it's compromised passed my comfort zone.Do I need to have it rebored or just replated?At 20thou miles,are my rod big ends causing this?What the hell is rod twisting in the manual,anyone ever check this?I don't have any up and down movement on the rod,but it does feel like it rocks.JC,what am I looking for on the wrist pins?It's starting to sound like this classroom won't be dismissed in a while!HEY,on the bright side,I just celebrated 6 yrs.of no drugs!
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I wondered why the baseball kept getting bigger. Then it hit me.
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