donwirux9
Parking Attendant
Posts: 24
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posted July 30, 2004 05:41 PM
Air Shifters
Is there anyone using Muzzys air shifter with the digi. kill ? What do you think about it ? Or your thoughts on air shifters an who makes the best ? Don
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donwirux9
  
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wannabe
Pro
Posts: 1931
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posted July 31, 2004 08:34 AM
I've got a somewhat home made setup with parts that I bought from Spencer Cycle. I went this route because I already had an NLR 2-step that doubled as the engine kill. But, if I had to do it all over again, the Muzzy setup with the high pressure CO2 system is tits. I have to fill up my air tank after every pass. With the Muzzy setup, you're good for the whole race.
Having said that, I don't think you can go wrong with anyone's kit as long as you install it correctly. An air shifter is pretty much a no-brainer once it's on the bike. Just go ahead and buy the Muzzy kit and install it. You won't regret it.
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donwirux9
Parking Attendant
Posts: 24
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posted July 31, 2004 10:30 AM
Thats what I was kinda thinkin myself. Don P.S hey Wannabe didnt you have a Dale Walker PS3 at one time.
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donwirux9
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RAC4IT
Needs a job
Bergie
Posts: 3009
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posted July 31, 2004 04:39 PM
you dont need an airshifter; it wont show any gain in ET and you're more likely to lose a race because of a missed shift
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CrotchRocket
Moderator
Bracket Racing with Betsy
Posts: 8038
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posted July 31, 2004 05:28 PM
I second what RAC4IT says!!!...I go 9.50s all the time foot shifting...
Once you find your technique and comfortable possition, then it doesnt matter if you have an air shifter or foot shift...Go to www.dontbescaredracing.com and check out the videos of Ryan Schnitz on a ZX12 and Norm Jackson on a ZX10 both foot shifting!!!
But if you really want an air shifter I would get the electric over air, which shifts automatically at the rpm you set the box at!!!
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Jason Miller StreetBike Seminars
*****DragRacers do it better, because they dont cut Corners*****
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted July 31, 2004 06:20 PM
Rac4it and CR are both experienced, fast guys, BUT... I do NOT agree with em for average guys like me.
I have a Dale Walker electric shifter & Dyna shift light, and I know my ET's are quicker and more consistent than when I foot shifted. I will guarantee you foot shiftin' guys cannot shift as fast or as consistently as a well set up electic or air shifter.
Look at the tire marks after a hard launch, WOT 1-2 shift. Mine only leaves a (v clearly defined) 6"- 8" space where the bike was shifting. If you have an ign interrupt for yr foot shifting set up, you could do it, but getting yr foot on the peg isn't that easy for most folks.
Added benefit: pushing that button has saved my butt several times by short shifting 1-2 when the front wheel started coming up.
I understand that CR & Berg don't see benefit outa push button shifters, but they are extra-talented exceptions.. 
They have a point about missed shifts. Neither the electric or air shifters like shifting when you put it into the limiter. Other than that, my PS3 doesn't miss shifts.
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CrotchRocket
Moderator
Bracket Racing with Betsy
Posts: 8038
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posted July 31, 2004 08:00 PM
Thanks Karl...I just chose to stay with foot shifting incase i decide to get into SuperSport DragRacing...
I like the auto shift though...Its like an automatic
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Jason Miller StreetBike Seminars
*****DragRacers do it better, because they dont cut Corners*****
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TurboBlew
Moderator
BUSY DOING THE SCHIAVO
Posts: 4590
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posted July 31, 2004 08:57 PM
An airshifter can work when setup properly.... Id say anywhere from 1/10th-3/10ths.
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wannabe
Pro
Posts: 1931
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posted July 31, 2004 09:23 PM
 Edited By: wannabe on 31 Jul 2004 22:25
I totally disagree with Bergie and Crotchrocket on this one. An air shifter DOES help your ET's. No matter how good of a foot shifter you are, you still lose some ET when you get off the gas to shift to the next gear. It may not be much, but you do lose ET. The kill time on the motor is just a fraction of a second. The exact kill time will depend on where you mount your air solenoid. The idea is that you keep lowering the kill time until it doesn't shift. Then you go back up one click. I gained a full tenth with just the air shifter...then a couple more when I geared the bike waaaaay down. I'm now in 6th going through the traps. The air shifter allowed me to do that because I no longer had to worry about getting my feet on the pegs to shift.
Plus, the air shifter helps you if you decide to run any of the Super categories like Super Gas (9.90) You can slow down your bike consistently by just turning up the kill time accordingly to get you slowed down to 9.90. I waited forever to put an air shifter on my bike. Now that I have one, I regret not putting one on a long long time ago.
And, I agree with Entropy. It makes the bike safer on the launch (if you're not using wheelie bars.) If the front end comes up way too high, you can press the button and shift to get the front back down.
So, I stand by my earlier recommendation. Oh, I almost forgot, no that wasn't me that had the Dale Walker. But, if were still planning on riding my bike on the street, I probably would have gone with the Dale Walker instead.
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krexken
Zone Head
Posts: 732
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posted August 01, 2004 05:25 AM
I recently got to put an air shifter on my old zx12. I also get to ride the bike pretty regularly at the track. I slammed the limiter several times the first few passes I made and the bike has never failed to shift. I still have difficulty finding the horn button quick enough for the 1-2 shift though. Overall, I like it and will probably put one on my bike mainly so I can stay over the front end better at the top of first gear. What I don't like is the price! You can get the air cylinder and solenoid from Grainger or MSC and piece together one a bunch cheaper. As far as cutout boxes, the MPS works fine but you have to tie into all four coil grounds! What's up with that! My Dale Walker box only needs to interrupt the hot coil feed (one wire) to work and it works great. I kinda like using only the DW cutout box cause most people think I'm a kickass footshifter and I have no unsightly, gangly air cyclinder hanging off my bike while I'm riding on the street.
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donwirux9
Parking Attendant
Posts: 24
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posted August 01, 2004 06:16 AM
Hey Ken hows it going ? Are you telling me you managed to get your ps3 to workto where you have faith in it makin all the shifts . I as well as 3 buddys have the ps3 no one yet has managed to get theres workin right ,where you can have any faith in the thing shifting. They work not bad on the street but at the track under full load it sucks ! If it was just mine I would think it needed to be adjusted , but all 4 of us !! Don
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donwirux9
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RAC4IT
Needs a job
Bergie
Posts: 3009
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posted August 01, 2004 10:42 AM
Gain of 3 tenths? Are you kidding me? Maybe if you add NITROUS at the same time, or the rider belongs in the special olympics. Unless you're going quicker than mid 8s, or physically handicap, there is absolutely no reason to use an airshifter. Waste of money
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zrxdean
Needs a job
Posts: 2225
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posted August 01, 2004 01:07 PM
Get an airshifter Don, you won't regret it.
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TurboBlew
Moderator
BUSY DOING THE SCHIAVO
Posts: 4590
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posted August 01, 2004 05:25 PM
1-3/10ths...lol. Some may see a .5 second difference...hehe.
quote:
Gain of 3 tenths? Are you kidding me? Maybe if you add NITROUS at the same time, or the rider belongs in the special olympics. Unless you're going quicker than mid 8s, or physically handicap, there is absolutely no reason to use an airshifter. Waste of money
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1bad12r
Zone Head
Posts: 567
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posted August 02, 2004 03:54 AM
I'm definitly an airshifter man !
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768 Ryderz
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted August 02, 2004 05:38 AM
quote:
... They work not bad on the street but at the track under full load it sucks ! If it was just mine I would think it needed to be adjusted , but all 4 of us !! Don
I am sorry to see guys having so much trouble, because that sure hasn't been my experience.
Maybe all 4 of you are setting it up the same problematic way??
My PS3 ROCKS! It took a bit of set up a couple years ago, but really no more trouble that what I have seen folks doing with air shifters. Mine has been 100% reliable, ONLY missing shifts when I get into the limiter, and air shifters seem like they have the same problem.
I heard that the PS3 was no good w/Big motors, but I don't know how BIG those folks were meaning; maybe turbo??? Maybe Nitrous folks are having trouble???
With good air/traction my TFA big motor/10" arm is turning consistent high 8's @ 154-158mph. I haven't missed a shift in a l-o-n-g time except when losing traction and going into the limiter.
I wonder what you guys are doing???????
1. maybe you have a tight bend in the puller cable and its binding?
2. do you have the cable adjusted so the solenoid is set up to "clank", i.e. bottom out when shifting??
3. do you have the microswitch set to trigger correctly in the pulling cycle?
4. do you have the kill box set up, and the toggle switch wired right???
When you arm the system, can you toe it into the next gear at WOT wo/using the clutch??? That's the first test.
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DR JOE
Expert Class
Posts: 352
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posted August 02, 2004 06:00 AM
Edited By: DR JOE on 2 Aug 2004 07:00
Hey Wannabe
What gearing are you running now???
DR JOE
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krexken
Zone Head
Posts: 732
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posted August 02, 2004 06:34 AM
Edited By: krexken on 2 Aug 2004 07:39
I've only got the Walker cutout box, not the solenoid, so I still have to use my foot. Only time I miss a gear is when I get lax and don't shift it solidly. I have two other friends at the track that use the solenoid job without problems. I'm too cheap to buy the solenoid job. An air shifter is my next move.
Dean! You using the swingarm as an air tank? Seen anyone using a JMC arm as one? I'd hate to swell up the tubing.
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zrxdean
Needs a job
Posts: 2225
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posted August 02, 2004 07:17 AM
No, I have a 1lb tank with nitrous in it & a regulator. One less hassle. The JMC square section has a center rib in it - so it might not hold as much as you like. Good & thick tho, I doubt it would feel the effects.
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draggsxr1000
Expert Class
Posts: 190
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posted August 20, 2004 07:46 AM
Hear again under a new name former draggsxr 750 now bumpin the 1000 label soon to be bigger lol. A proper air shifter for a rookie will me a difference i can foot shift quite well from my road racing experiece. It made about .2 on my 1/8 second time mostly cause i felt as if i could launch harder and didnt have to come up for the shifter. Also im not all that small and can use any aero i can get stay low no moving or flaping my wings lol thanks guys
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