jonwright
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posted February 19, 2003 09:14 AM
Key paragraph here, fellas:
"The draft was justified in World War II because the life of the people collectively was at stake. Individuals had to fight, if the nation was to survive, for the lives of their countrymen and their way of life. Vietnam is no such case. Nor was Korea an example, where, in my opinion, certain military action was justified but the draft was not, for the reasons stated above. "
  
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jonwright
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posted February 19, 2003 09:15 AM
GO 12RPILOT! They are all scum!
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VincentHill
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posted February 19, 2003 09:22 AM
Slug and others, I have no problem with some oof the things you say and I say again that the Best person does not always make the best president and George Bush is in no way the Best man and to me, here is a reason why!
October 11, 2002
Addiction, Brain Damage and the President "Dry Drunk" Syndrome and George W. Bush
by Katherine van Wormer
Ordinarily I would not use this term. But when I came across the article '"Dry Drunk" -- Is Bush Making a Cry for Help?' in 'American Politics Journal' by Alan Bisbort, I was ready to concede ... in the case of George W. Bush, the phrase may be quite apt.
Dry drunk is a slang term used by members and supporters of Alcoholics Anonymous and substance abuse counselors to describe the recovering alcoholic who is no longer drinking -- one who is dry, but whose thinking is clouded. Such an individual is said to be 'dry' but not truly sober.
Such an individual tends to go to extremes.
It was when I started noticing the extreme language that colored President Bush's speeches that I began to wonder. First there were the terms -- "crusade" and "infinite justice" that were later withdrawn. Next came "evil-doers", "axis of evil", and "regime change", terms that have almost become cliches in the mass media.
Something about the polarized thinking and the obsessive repetition reminded me of many of the recovering alcoholics/addicts I had treated (a point worth noting is that because of the connection between addiction and
"stinking thinking", relapse prevention usually consists of work in the cognitive area).
Having worked with recovering alcoholics for years, I flinched at the single-mindedness and ego- and ethno-centricity in the President's speeches (my husband likened his phraseology to the gardener character played by Peter Sellers in the movie, Being There). Since words are the tools - the representations -- of thought, I wondered what Bush's choice of words said about where he was coming from. Or where we would be going.
First, in this essay, we will look at the characteristics of the so-called "dry drunk" -- then we will see if they apply to this individual, our president -- and then we will review his drinking history for the record.
What is the dry drunk syndrome? "Dry drunk" traits consist of:
Exaggerated self-importance and pomposity Grandiose behavior.
A rigid, judgmental outlook
Impatience
Childish behavior
Irresponsible behavior
Irrational rationalization
Projection
Overreaction
Clearly, George W. Bush has all these traits except exaggerated self-importance. He may be pompous, especially with regard to international dealings, but his actual importance hardly can be exaggerated. His power, in fact, is such that if he collapses into paranoia, a large part of the world will collapse with him. Unfortunately, there are some indications of paranoia in statements such as the following: "We must be prepared to stop rogue states and their terrorist clients before they are able to threaten or use weapons of mass destruction against the United States and our allies and friends." The trait of projection is evidenced here as well, projection of the fact that we are ready to attack onto another nation which may not be so inclined.
Bush's rigid, judgmental outlook comes across in virtually all his speeches. To fight evil, Bush is ready to take on the world, in almost a Biblical sense. Consider his statement with reference to Israel: "Look my job isn't to try to nuance. I think moral clarity is important ... this is evil versus good."
Bush's tendency to dichotomize reality is not on the Internet list above, but it should be, as this tendency to polarize is symptomatic of the classic addictive thinking pattern. I describe this thinking distortion in 'Addiction Treatment: A Strengths Perspective' as either/or reasoning-- "either you are with us or against us". Oddly, Bush used those very words in his dealings with other nations. All-or-nothing thinking is a related mode of thinking commonly found in newly-recovering alcoholics/addicts. Such a worldview traps people in a pattern of destructive behavior.
Obsessive thought patterns are also pronounced in persons prone to addiction. There are organic reasons for this due to brain chemistry irregularities; messages in one part of the brain become stuck there. This leads to maddening repetition of thoughts. President Bush seems unduly focused upon getting revenge on Saddam Hussein ("he tried to kill my Dad"), leading the country and the world into war, accordingly.
Grandiosity enters the picture as well. What Bush is proposing to Congress is not the right to attack on one country but a total shift in military policy: America would now have the right to take military action before the adversary even has the capacity to attack. This is in violation, of course, of international law as well as national precedent. How to explain this grandiose request? Jane Bryant Quinn provides the most commonly offered explanation in a recent Newsweek editorial, "Iraq: It's the Oil, Stupid". Many other opponents of the Bush doctrine similarly seek a rational motive behind the obsession over first, the war on terror and now, Iraq. I believe the explanation goes deeper than oil, that Bush's logic is being given too much credit; I believe his obsession is far more visceral.
On this very day, a peace protestor in Portland held up the sign, "Drunk on Power". This, I believe, is closer to the truth. The drive for power can be an unquenchable thirst, addictive in itself. Senator William Fulbright, in his popular bestseller of the 1960s, 'The Arrogance of Power', masterfully described the essence of power-hungry politics as the pursuit of power; this he conceived as an end in itself. "The causes and consequences of war may have more to do with pathology than with politics", he wrote, "more to do with irrational pressures of pride and pain than with rational calculation of advantage and profit."
Another "dry drunk" trait is impatience. Bush is far from a patient man: "If we wait for threats to fully materialize", he said in a speech he gave at West Point, "we will have waited too long". Significantly, Bush only waited for the United Nations and for Congress to take up the matter of Iraq's disarmament with extreme reluctance. Alan Bisbort argues that Bush possesses the characteristics of the "dry drunk" in terms of: his incoherence while speaking away from the script; his irritability with anyone (for example, Germany's Schroeder) who dares disagree with him; and his dangerous obsessing about only one thing (Iraq) to the exclusion of all other things.
In short, George W. Bush seems to possess the traits characteristic of addictive persons who still have the thought patterns that accompany substance abuse. If we consult the latest scientific findings, we will discover that scientists can now observe changes that occur in the brain as a result of heavy alcohol and other drug abuse. Some of these changes may be permanent. Except in extreme cases, however, these cognitive impairments would not be obvious to most observers.
To reach any conclusions we need of course to know Bush's personal history relevant to drinking/drug use. To this end I consulted several biographies. Yes, there was much drunkenness -- years of binge drinking starting in college, at least one conviction for DUI in 1976 in Maine, and one arrest before that for a drunken episode involving theft of a Christmas wreath. According to J. D. Hatfield's book, 'Fortunate Son', Bush later explained: "[A]lcohol began to compete with my energies ... I'd lose focus". Although he once said he couldn't remember a dayhe hadn't had a drink, he added that he didn't believe he was "clinically alcoholic".
Even his father, who had known for years that his son had a serious drinking problem, publicly proclaimed: "He was never an alcoholic. It's just he knows he can't hold his liquor." Bush drank heavily for over 20 years until he made the decision to abstain at age 40. About this time he became a "born again Christian", going as usual from one extreme to the other. During an Oprah interview, Bush acknowledged that his wife had told him he needed to think about what he was doing. When asked in another interview about his reported drug use, he answered honestly, "I'm not going to talk about what I did 20 to 30 years ago".
That there might be a tendency toward addiction in Bush's family is indicated in the recent arrests or criticism of his daughters for underage drinking and his niece for cocaine possession. Bush, of course, deserves credit for his realization that he can't drink moderately, and his decision today to abstain. The fact that he doesn't drink moderately may be suggestive of an inability to handle alcohol. In any case, Bush has clearly gotten his life in order and is in good physical condition, careful to exercise and rest when he needs to do so. The fact that some residual effects from his earlier substance abuse -- however slight -- might cloud the U. S. President's thinking and judgment is frightening, however, in the context of the current global crisis.
One final consideration that might come into play in the foreign policy realm relates to Bush's history relevant to his father. The Bush biography reveals the story of a boy named for his father, sent to the exclusive private school in the East where his father's reputation as star athlete and later war hero were still remembered. The younger George's achievements were dwarfed in the school's memory of his father. Athletically he could not achieve his father's laurels, being smaller and perhaps less strong. His drinking bouts and lack of intellectual gifts held him back as well. He was popular and well liked, however. His military record was mediocre as compared to his father's as well. Bush entered the Texas National Guard. What he did there remains largely a mystery. There are reports of a lot of barhopping during this period. It would be only natural that Bush would want to prove himself today, that he would feel somewhat uncomfortable following, as before, in his father's footsteps. I mention these things because when you follow his speeches, Bush seems bent on a personal crusade. One motive is to avenge his father. Another seems to be to prove himself to his father. In fact, Bush seems to be trying somehow to achieve what his father failed to do -- to finish the job of the Gulf War, to get the "evildoer" Saddam.
To summarize, George W. Bush manifests all the classic patterns of what alcoholics in recovery call "the dry drunk". His behavior is consistent with barely noticeable but meaningful brain damage brought on by years of heavy drinking and possible cocaine use. All the classic patterns of addictive thinking that are spelled out in my book are here: the tendency to go to extremes (leading America into a massive 100 billion dollar strike-first war); a "kill or be killed mentality;" the tunnel vision; "I" as opposed to "we" thinking; the black and white polarized thought processes (good versus evil, all or nothing thinking). His drive to finish his father's battles is of no small significance, psychologically.
If the public (and politicians) could only see what Fulbright noted as 'the pathology in the politics.' One day, sadly, they will.
katherine van wormer
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Otis
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posted February 19, 2003 09:57 AM
That's pretty compelling Vincent, lol but really now. You pull an article which is an OPINION of this person written for Counterpunch a liberal newsmag that states this on thier website.
"Ours is muckraking with a radical attitude and nothing makes us happier than when CounterPunch readers write in to say how useful they've found our newsletter in their battles against the war machine, big business and the rapers of nature."
You're post holds no value and if her opinion of Gearge Bush being a "dry drunk" is the reason you think he is no way the best man for President, I feel sorry for you.
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It's a free country brother
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VincentHill
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posted February 19, 2003 10:26 AM
 Edited By: VincentHill on 19 Feb 2003 10:28
Otis, to be 100% Honest, I do not like Bush for a lot of reasons, but the #1 Reason is "I do not think he is QUALIFTED to be President of a Junk Yard, let alone of the USA. I may not care for republicans, but I would have voted for John McCain. At least he did not visit Bob Jones College where Separation is taught! He was a True War Hero. He was Captured, injured and offered Freedom and did not leave! He votes what he believed, not what other's tell him!
When you have lived for 60 years as a Black Man in this country, "THEN" you would be able to understand why we loved Clinton. As far as I am Concerned, we have already had out first Black President, except if he had been black, he would have been treated better for fear of back lash. He was a man lacking in moral character, but is was the Human problems that also endeared him to us. I am a hell of a lot better off now than I was before he became president. I will even go so far to say that I may be as well of as my counterparts that are not black. Yes, I am Poor as Hell, but at an entirely different level. Small savings, 2 retirement funds, a couple pieces of property, with both working in a family of 2. We are not in tripple digits, but we make enough to "Give" over $14,000 to Charity last year, while helping out friends and family. Also I do not think I am over taxed except for the fact that Living in the District of Columbia and having no representation in Congress, I should not pay "ANY" taxes!
Rogue vs. Rhodes I liked the way it looks and sounded
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Made History @ Daytona and still one fast old man!!
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Otis
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posted February 19, 2003 10:52 AM
Let's just agree to disagree Vincent. But I have one follow up question that I am anxious to hear your answr to. You state
"At least he did not visit Bob Jones College where Separation is taught!"
Then is it not to be assumed that you are outraged about Clinton when he praised segregationist Arkansas Senator William Fulbright. Now I can't imagine you being anything BUT outraged by this Vincent. Why is he so great when then.
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It's a free country brother
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ZHooligan
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posted February 19, 2003 11:05 AM
Now Vincent we know that is BS! You get two Votes! One in Maryland and one Virginia!!
Do you really believe clinton cared? It is one thing to promise change and another to accomplish it. If I had the money to give everyone in the world a billion dollars I would. In fact I am going to ask Congress to that. Thats easy to say especially when you know it isn't possible.
I can say for certain that Clinton has the ability to make people feel good. His town hall meetings were magical. But TV evangolists are great at making people feel good and not really being sincere. I put Bill into that catagory. I'd rather be told the truth good or bad news then the I feel your pain stuff.
Was not the Senate Majority Leader Mr. Byrd (a democrat) a KKK member, a high ranking one at that? Was he not a recruiter for the Klan? How could you or did you suport your party then? He was also the man that tried desperately to get the Florida vote thrown out and all of the armed services vote thrown out to get Gore elected.
BUsh visited a University that has in fact had several of your fine democratic leaders visit and speak at. Some whom have received and accepted honorary degrees from Bob Jones University. Had Martin Luther King or any other African American leader been given a chance to talk with that group of people they would have. Why? Because that is the only way these biggots and racists will ever actually have to set down and talk to someone with an opposing position. There is nothing in George Bush's past, in his family etc. that even remotely makes him out to be a racist except for democratic party BS. For Gods sake the Democratic lieutenant governer of Texas stood up with Bush when he was nominated. Bush has a history of working with everyone.
Not to pick on Elk or his state, but have you been to Arkansas? Bill was in charge of the state for years. The smartest man in the world. the friend of children, common people and people of color. The state did not improve. The schools and industry etc. all remained in the tank. Bill is a TV Evangilist. He tells people what they want to hear and makes them feel good while his hand is in their wallet. You are right about Jimmy Carter. Probably one of the nicest and most decent guys to be president. I don't agree with everything he pitches but he was and still is a decent guy. But I would have to ask you a question. I don't know where you grew up at, but in my case 4 of the houses I lived in as a kid have had the street renamed to Martin Luther King Way. So I can say I grew up in some pretty tough neighborhoods. And I am proud of that. That said if I had used Carters turn the other cheek mentality, and peace is best brother attitude I would be dead.
I would appreciate if you could show me one single piece of legislation that Clinton actually passed for the Black community. Al Gore's father voted against the equal rights ammendment. The Republicans passed it into law. The problem is the democratic party is not the party it was when you were a young man. It does not want to solve your problems. Your problems are speaking points that they use to get elections. Without those speaking point they would have to do something else.
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To those who do not count their life in years, but in how life
has touched them in the past and how much it can hold in the
future; -- Youth is forever.
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redelk
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Please... speak to the hand.
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posted February 19, 2003 11:15 AM
How are you so sure he's suffering from a "dry drunk" and not just on a "pink cloud"? So Vincent, how long have you been a friend of Bill W.'s (no relation to clinton)? If not, I don't think repeating someone's "clinical opinion" of what a dry drunk is not quite within your authority. Someone who is an alcoholic and is not currently drinking is NOT always a "dry drunk".
I might only have 2336 days in the program (meth, crack cocaine and alcohol), but I know that no two alcoholics or addicts (which our president is neither) are the same. To accuse someone who said that felt they had a "problem with alcohol" as an alcoholic is rather prejudicial. I can't imagine you being one of prejudice, but when it comes to problem drinkers, alcoholics and addicts, your words indicate otherwise. That is sad... very sad.
Still, I still consider you to be my friend and I would enjoy riding with you... as long as we agree not to talk politics or alcoholism/addiction.
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There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games.
-Ernest Hemingway
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freek
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ummm... yeah
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posted February 19, 2003 01:43 PM
12rpilot, i was just wanting to say the same thing! i'm a little surprised with the "saint vs devil" way many people here are talkin about the 2 parties. seems people are quick to forget also that parties are made up of MANY people. some will be straight talkers & truly believe what they stand for (whichever side of the political spectrum it is), and others will be there for reasons as selfish as bin laden. finally, and i could be wrong on this one not being completely up on the details of the american poli system, but this obsession with the president seems rather like blaming the storefront manikin [sp] for the quality of the clothes. the president himself can't possibly make all these decisions on his own. and if he does, it's going to be based on whatever info is fed him, which is likely both more skewed and more accurate than what the public gets.
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slug
Pro
Out in search of my mind...
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posted February 19, 2003 01:55 PM
Edited By: slug on 19 Feb 2003 14:14
up til now overall cluelessness who?
;P
where does now start...(trying to decide if i have been maligned or not ;P)
(this in reply to post on page 1)
this next election, will suck. if they offer gore up again, i will be forced to vote repugnant JUST to make sure gore doesn't EVER set foot inthe white house ever again. maybe they can put someone useful onthe ballot, if they h ave a good freedom and rights history, i will be MUCH happier to vote that way, as bush and his admin HAVE shown their disregard for american freedoms. (patriot act, etc, yes, it was bipartisan, but he did NOT have to sign it...or push for it for that matter)
As far as a different point of view, from non-racist view, check some of Ken Hamblin's work. He has some interesting research about the various political parties, and in general of life.
http://www.hamblin.com/main.html
if you read nothing else of what i have posted, please DO read his site. great guy.
  
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jonwright
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posted February 19, 2003 02:13 PM
'Dry drunk'. God, that's one of the funniest things I've heard today.
Jeez, I thought you pulled that off of The Onion.
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ZHooligan
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posted February 19, 2003 04:03 PM
Hey Slug.... Ken Hamblin is awesome. Tells like it is. Makes no excuses, calls everyone out and holds them accountable. Really pisses the libs off especially. I listen to him when ever I can, I catch him late when I'm working in the shop.
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To those who do not count their life in years, but in how life
has touched them in the past and how much it can hold in the
future; -- Youth is forever.
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fish_antlers
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The Truth is Out There
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posted February 19, 2003 04:39 PM
Edited By: fish_antlers on 19 Feb 2003 16:43
a liberal= "pass the bong man... I need another toke.."
a conservative= (hiding bong) "what bong? I never saw any weed around here.. turns to liberal and asks: "man... can you hide this weed for me?"
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moodybluezx12r
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posted February 19, 2003 05:04 PM
quote:
I may not care for republicans, but I would have voted for John McCain. At least he did not visit Bob Jones College where Separation is taught! He was a True War Hero. He was Captured, injured and offered Freedom and did not leave! He votes what he believed, not what other's tell him!
now vince we are of like minds..John McCain, would have gotten my vote too...now back to bush...now you conserves honestly have to admit one thing about the prez that is undeniable..he is a dummy...now conserves..is he not a dummy?..man i hate to think what would happend if he had to make decisions on his own...now that's a scary thought...
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ZHooligan
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posted February 19, 2003 05:24 PM
He's so dumb that he put together a team and lead the team all the way to being the President of the United States. So keep calling him dumb. Tom Dashel and Gephart thought the same. Thats why they are talking to themselves and whining!
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To those who do not count their life in years, but in how life
has touched them in the past and how much it can hold in the
future; -- Youth is forever.
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moodybluezx12r
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posted February 19, 2003 07:20 PM
Edited By: moodybluezx12r on 19 Feb 2003 19:21
bush's idea of home land security......
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Raleigh, NC
Ride it! Like You Stole It!
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addisonzx12
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posted February 19, 2003 07:25 PM
It's called buying a election, the rich & powerful do it all the time. Usually republican, sometimes democrat always crooked. Did you know you can't BUY a degree from harvard either(yeah right).
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addisonzx12
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posted February 19, 2003 07:31 PM
You forgot the plastic to cover the windows with. How many hours of air are in the average house if it is completely sealed, anyway. Maybe 12? After that we just hold our breath, right?
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Otis
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posted February 20, 2003 04:14 AM
Vincent?
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It's a free country brother
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Otis
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posted February 20, 2003 04:16 AM
Edited By: Otis on 20 Feb 2003 04:17
Moody and Addison you need your heads unstuck from Dowd's ass, you'll suffocate eventually.
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It's a free country brother
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Ninjaman12R
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as a Deal's Gap tour guide.
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posted February 20, 2003 04:40 AM
Excellent.........
quote:
Moody and Addison you need your heads unstuck from Dowd's ass, you'll suffocate eventually.
A most excellent observation C. , it's sure to prompt a "colorful" reply. 
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What we're dealin' with here is a complete lack of respect for the law.
Sheriff Buford T. Justice of TEXAS
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Otis
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posted February 20, 2003 05:36 AM
What's up Rick? How's the new woman?
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It's a free country brother
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12RPilot
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posted February 20, 2003 06:22 AM
I wasn't trying to malign anyone in particular Slug. It's just that there is so much BS being spread here by folks that don't really have a complete grasp on how the government really works. Seems that the whole country believes that the president writes his own budget, spends all the money, controls the economy and changes laws at every whim. It just ain't that simple. The pres merely influences most government functions. And when the congress and pres are different parties the pres has even less influence. Of course, when things are going good, you credit your man if he's in office. If the pres is of the other party, then he is just lucky. Some in this thread have a little more handle on this than others, but across the country, the majority are clueless. For instance, my elderly neighbor noticed that there are more potholes in the streets than 10 years ago. Damn that Bush!!! I can only shake my head. It's not so bad if they don't vote, but some are registered. Scary doo-doo. And how many put credence in what these dim witted celebs spew?
What it all boils down to is: those that think they are right annoy the hell out of us who REALLY ARE!!! LOL (Whew. My finger is tired)
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http://www.bikepics.com/members/12rpilot/04zx10r/
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addisonzx12
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posted February 20, 2003 07:09 AM
Ah, FUCK IT , time will tell. I wished I owned a duct tape company right now, don't you
.
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bagster
Zone Head
Posts: 630
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posted February 20, 2003 07:38 AM
I wish I had a roll of that GREEN duct tape, I bet it goes on faster.
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