posted December 21, 2010 05:18 PM
Light years ahead of current 1903 designs still puts them in the dark ages...and gas mileage/fuel management on the HD isn't better than on a stock ZX14 or Busa for that matter. Having owned scores of (and still owning) HD's myself, I can honestly say that there's nothing technologically advanced about them...what, like the ability to shutdown one cylinder at a traffic light???? Wowie...big technology advance...
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FYYFF!!!
quote:Light years ahead of current 1903 designs still puts them in the dark ages...and gas mileage/fuel management on the HD isn't better than on a stock ZX14 or Busa for that matter. Having owned scores of (and still owning) HD's myself, I can honestly say that there's nothing technologically advanced about them...what, like the ability to shutdown one cylinder at a traffic light???? Wowie...big technology advance...
Have you seen the tuning software for the injection? How you can access all the most minute control details? Compare that to a power commander, lol....
Needs a job
spell chequer is bustimicated
Posts: 2909
posted December 21, 2010 05:28 PM
Edited By: thekaz on 22 Dec 2010 01:29
OMG so the new HD bikes can have their full maps viewed and changed
WOW I am overwhelmed
posted December 21, 2010 05:51 PM
I have one a lot of the time
But europe smacking their street bikes and KTM in australia smacking their off-road stuff, they better man-up
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2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
posted December 21, 2010 07:11 PM
I am rather pleased that mother Kawi is stepping up to the plate to buy back the few defective bikes that made it out onto the market defective. I understand a few people are “bashing” the company for doing the right thing but we all now the argument that “they had to do it” is BS how many other recalls have been done by Kawi and other manufacturers where they only looked at the short term bottom line. I am pissed I did not buy one the day they became available but with 4-5 months to go before riding season is here again I guess at least for people in my neck of the woods they have a few more months reprieve to have it back on the street.
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ZX14 - Flies out,Full Yosh CF,PCIII,Dark Smoke, Thottlemister, Fender Eliminator, CF Hugger, BMC Race Fillter
posted December 21, 2010 07:35 PM
if you look at the the bikes to beat. i think kaw had a lot of them till the busa came out. i my self am pissed they did not blow the mags like susike did but that is marketing and the busa has a better chance of getting a better short time than the 12.
lets let them go and see if they get back on top when all the hype and bullshit settles on this.
quote:Light years ahead of current 1903 designs still puts them in the dark ages...and gas mileage/fuel management on the HD isn't better than on a stock ZX14 or Busa for that matter. Having owned scores of (and still owning) HD's myself, I can honestly say that there's nothing technologically advanced about them...what, like the ability to shutdown one cylinder at a traffic light???? Wowie...big technology advance...
Have you seen the tuning software for the injection? How you can access all the most minute control details? Compare that to a power commander, lol....
Nothing more than slick marketing - and if you listen to the HD owners who eat this shit up...it's the greatest thing in the world and an HD is the greatest thing ever.
Fact is, the JAP/German bikes don't even need that shit...because they're so far ahead of HD in everything, except marketing of course, and why? Cuz how the fuck else do you sell underpowered, overpriced pieces of shit for so much money and make people think they're riding the greatest thing since sliced bread? Answer: Slick marketing with huge budgets to build brand and product awareness. HD is one of the greatest American marketing success stories ever...
They currently rank high up in the top 100 renown brands worldwide...so you know what motherfucker? Put that in yer pipe and smoke it! ____________
FYYFF!!!
posted December 21, 2010 08:35 PM
Edited By: Shane661 on 22 Dec 2010 04:38
quote:Nothing more than slick marketing - and if you listen to the HD owners who eat this shit up...it's the greatest thing in the world and an HD is the greatest thing ever.
Fact is, the JAP/German bikes don't even need that shit...because they're so far ahead of HD in everything, except marketing of course, and why? Cuz how the fuck else do you sell underpowered, overpriced pieces of shit for so much money and make people think they're riding the greatest thing since sliced bread? Answer: Slick marketing with huge budgets to build brand and product awareness. HD is one of the greatest American marketing success stories ever...
They currently rank high up in the top 100 renown brands worldwide...so you know what motherfucker? Put that in yer pipe and smoke it!
Not sure what you are talking about? I am not into HD's from a "fan" perspective, and would not own one. But I have seen the range of tuning capability in a private shop. It is somewhat akin to what you can do with ECU flashing on the Busa...only the parameters are well defined, and supported at a higher level. Even something as "old-tech" as a knock sensor would be an innovation on the 14 or Busa.
posted December 22, 2010 08:01 AM
We already have anti-knock technology on both bikes you mentioned...
What - are you saying that there's actually new technology on HD bikes, because you have factory supported tuning capability in them? Is that what I'm hearing from you? That shit on HD bikes is as old as the hills...it's only a marketing thing and does little in terms of power enhancements, so if that's "technology" for you...you win. Fact is, there's very little gain (nothing perceptible) when you "tune" these engines using their tuners/software. They only allow you to increase tuning to within a very conservative and safe limit. Many JAP sport bikes already have technology on them that makes the HD so called technology you refer to - pale by comparison. Seen any HD's with traction control lately...
Give us some real examples of high tech innovations on HD bikes...please.....
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FYYFF!!!
posted December 22, 2010 08:07 AM
Why would a Harley "need" traction control? My Buell XB-12R would spin up the rear a little exiting curves and straight line in lower gears but it was far from needing traction control. And I have never ridden a Harley that needed it. So that is a bit of a moot point.
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2008 ZX14
Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference. ~Mark Twain
posted December 22, 2010 08:11 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 22 Dec 2010 16:19
FBA, please show me the drawings which show the knock sensor on my 14....
You are really way, way off on the tuning. In fact, I did not even know that this is heavily "marketed" by HD? If you have used the software, then you know it would be a dream come true in sportbike apps.
This is a pointless argument...because all you are doing is trying to argue. I invite anyone to go to a good HD tuner and see this software in action.
Regarding other Harley tech...I am actually impressed with what they have done with these big, antiquated motors. Keeping the pushrod design is simply a marketing decision...but they have done a pretty good job of improving the reliability and efficiency of the product.
posted December 22, 2010 09:13 AM
you guys are taking Kawi so low you're comparing them to "HD"??? c'mon man that just ain't right
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2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
posted December 22, 2010 09:27 AM
FBA, You do know that riding that harley added years to your life? Just as Einstein said the faster you go the slower time goes by. Well the opposite happens when you ride a Harley.
Second,
I have seen the what can be done with the HD ECU and it is impressive. You are correct in one sense, BUT if we were afforded the luxury of being able to adjust our ECUs to that level, there would be no reason to have to remove the flies. We could open them as we saw fit, no FUCKING unreliable PCs.
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
posted December 22, 2010 10:14 AM
the only reason for HD's tuning software is to help dealers sell HD performance accessories which alot of their bikes don't leave the showroom without. good marketing to bump the price on an all-ready expensive bike
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"never drive faster than you can see, besides it's all in the reflexes"
posted December 22, 2010 10:34 AM
My 2002 Road king has traction control. If you hammer it hard coming out of a turn the clutch plates slip. so no tire spin. I have both and they are so far seperated by the type of people that ride both it's not even the same comparison.
quote:the only reason for HD's tuning software is to help dealers sell HD performance accessories which alot of their bikes don't leave the showroom without. good marketing to bump the price on an all-ready expensive bike
Regardless of the purpose...the software exists...as opposed to the $350 you will pay to have 1 or 2 parameters of your undocumented ZX-14 ECU altered.
quote:My 2002 Road king has traction control. If you hammer it hard coming out of a turn the clutch plates slip. so no tire spin. I have both and they are so far seperated by the type of people that ride both it's not even the same comparison.
Sorry that is not traction control, that is a poorly designed clutch. Your harley doesn't make enough hp to spin the tire if the bike is moving.
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
quote:the only reason for HD's tuning software is to help dealers sell HD performance accessories which alot of their bikes don't leave the showroom without. good marketing to bump the price on an all-ready expensive bike
Regardless of the purpose...the software exists...as opposed to the $350 you will pay to have 1 or 2 parameters of your undocumented ZX-14 ECU altered.
To do the fine adjustments to the harley, you still have to buy a unit. The way I understand it to work is the software talks to the unit and the unit programs the ECU. Then you remove that unit and keep it at home till you need it again, it also matches itself to the ECU and can't be used on other bikes.
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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posted December 21, 2010 05:18 PM
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