quote:they will either buy the bike back or ship a new engine to the dealer you bought it from and have them install it, im not worried since I know the master tech there is more anal about his work the Jenna Jameson lol....
kewl!
glad they're taking care of you
____________
2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
posted December 14, 2010 03:18 PM
Edited By: FastestBusaAround on 14 Dec 2010 23:23
quote:KHI is doing the right thing recalling their bikes at no expense to the consumer
rather than playing it off
they are probably aware of a vendor supplied item that may be in a bad batch
improper assembly from incorrect manufacturing set up or tolerances
whatever it may be KHI is doing the correct thing
standing buy their customers with integrity
Bullshit bullshit bullshit - they are doing this only for one reason:
The problem is of such magnitude, that legal got involved and let them know that if they didn't recall each and every one of them, fully refund the customer, they could and would be held liable in wrongful death lawsuits, injuries etc....because any other type of behavior would be totally reckless. They were probably also told that since they knew about the problem, if they didn't recall, they'd lose coverage by their insurance company and have to pay all claims and damages on their own, which could potentially put them out of business, for good. Bike /Auto manufacturers don't give money back for recalls...so for them to have done this, they must have had the riot act read to them by legal. They don't give a fuck about their customers, only their quarterly balance sheets/statements.
Ford got the snot sued out of them for the PINTO's exploding on contact..and they didn't give the customers their money back --
Read this and you'll understand why I say what I say. Don't think for one second that KHI didn't do the exact same math as Ford did in the article you'll read below...
"The Ford Pinto case is mentioned in most Business Ethics texts as an example of Cost-Benefit analysis, yet in those formats any appreciation of the complexity surrounding the issues of such decisions is overly simplified. As a thorough study, this book provides material that enriches the entire idea of
using a particular case as an avenue of learning about Ethics, Business, Society, Technology, and Government Regulation. Rather than as a mere reference tool for educators and other professionals, this book could be successful in the classroom in a way that no other anthology or collection of short case studies could be." - Greg Pasquarello, Neumann College
It was the late 60s, when the demand for sub-compacts was rising on the market. Iacocca's
specifications for the design of the car were uncompromising:
"The Pinto was not to weigh an ounce over 2,000 pounds and not cost a cent over $2,000."
During design and production, however, crash tests revealed a serious defect in the gas tank. In crashes over 25 miles per hour, the gas tank always ruptured. To correct it would have required changing and strengthening the design.
Many studies of reports and documents done by Mother Jones on rear-end collisions involving Pintos reveal that if you ran into that Pinto you were following at over 30 miles per hour, the rear end of the car would buckle like an accordion, right up to the back seat. The tube leading to the gas-tank cap would be ripped away from the tank itself, and gas would immediately begin sloshing onto the road around the car. The buckled gas tank would be jammed up against the differential housing (that big bulge in the middle of your rear axle), which contains four sharp, protruding bolts likely to gash holes in the tank and spill still more gas. Now all you need is a spark from a cigarette, ignition, or scraping metal, and both cars would be engulfed in flames. If you gave that Pinto a really good whack?say, at 40 mph - chances are excellent that its doors would jam and you would have to stand by and watch its trapped passengers burn to death.
In pre-production planning, engineers seriously considered using in the Pinto the same kind of gas tank Ford uses in the Capri. The Capri tank rides over the rear axle and differential housing. It has been so successful in over 50 crash tests that Ford used it in its Experimental Safety Vehicle, which withstood rear-end impacts of 60 mph. So why wasn't the Capri tank used in the Pinto? Or, why wasn't that plastic baffle placed between the tank and the axle - something that would have saved the life's hundreds of people.
President Semon "Bunky" Knudsen, whom Henry Ford II had hired away from General Motors, and Lee Iacocca, a spunky Young Turk who had risen fast within the company on the enormous success of the Mustang. Iacocca saying was that the Japanese were going to capture the entire American subcompact market unless Ford put out its own alternative to the VW Beetle. Bunky Knudsen said let them have the small-car market, but he lost the battle and later resigned. Iacocca became president and almost immediately began a rush program to produce the Pinto.
Lee Iococca wanted that little car in the showrooms of America with the 1971 models. So he ordered his engineering vice president, Bob Alexander, to oversee what was probably the shortest production planning period in modern automotive history. The normal time span from conception to production of a new car model is about 43 months. The Pinto schedule was set at just under 25.
When it was discovered the gas tank was unsafe, did anyone go to Iacocca and tell him? "Hell no," replied an engineer who worked on the Pinto, a high company official for many years, who, unlike several others at Ford, maintains a necessarily clandestine concern for safety. "That person would have been fired. Safety wasn't a popular subject around Ford in those days. Whenever a problem was raised that meant a delay on the Pinto, Lee would chomp on his cigar, look out the window and say 'Read the product objectives and get back to work."
The product objectives are clearly stated in the Pinto "green book." This is a thick, top-secret manual in green covers containing a step-by-step production plan for the model, detailing the metallurgy, weight, strength and quality of every part in the car. The product objectives for the Pinto are repeated in an article by Ford executive F.G. Olsen published by the Society of Automotive Engineers. He lists these product objectives as follows:
TRUE SUBCOMPACT
Size
Weight
LOW COST OF OWNERSHIP
Initial price
Fuel consumption
Reliability
Serviceability
CLEAR PRODUCT SUPERIORITY
Appearance
Comfort
Features
Ride and Handling
Performance
Safety, you will notice, is not there. It is not mentioned in the entire article. As Lee Iacocca was fond of saying, "Safety doesn't sell."
A Ford engineer, who doesn't want his name used, comments: "This company is run by salesmen, not engineers; so the priority is styling, not safety." He goes on to tell a story about gas-tank safety at Ford: Lou Tubben is one of the most popular engineers at Ford. He's a friendly, outgoing guy with a genuine concern for safety. By 1971 he had grown so concerned about gas-tank integrity that he asked his boss if he could prepare a presentation on safer tank design. Tubben and his boss had both worked on the Pinto and shared a concern for its safety. His boss gave him the go-ahead, scheduled a date for the presentation and invited all company engineers and key production planning personnel. When time came for the meeting, a grand total of two people showed up - Lou Tubben and his boss. "So you see," continued the anonymous Ford engineer ironically, "there are a few of us here at Ford who are concerned about fire safety." He adds: "They are mostly engineers who have to study a lot of accident reports and look at pictures of burned people. But we don't talk about it much. It isn't a popular subject.
Cost-Benefit Analysis
One of the tools that Ford used to argue for the delay was a "cost-benefit analysis" of altering the fuel tanks. According to Ford's estimates, the unsafe tanks would cause 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries, and 2,100 burned vehicles each year. It calculated that it would have to pay $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury, and $700 per vehicle, for a total of $49.5 million. However, the cost of saving lives and injuries ran even higher: alterations would cost $11 per car or truck, which added up to $137 million per year. Essentially, Ford argued before the government that it would be cheaper just to let their customers burn!
Summary Table
BENEFITS
Savings: 180 burn deaths, 180 serious burn injuries, 2,100 burned vehicles. Unit Cost: $200,000 per death, $67,000 per injury, $700 per vehicle.
Total Benefit: 180 X ($200,000) + 180 X ($67,000) + $2,100 X ($700) = $49.5 million.
COSTS
Sales: 11 million cars, 1.5 million light trucks.
Unit Cost: $11 per car, $11 per truck.
Total Cost: 11,000,000 X ($11) + 1,500,000 X ($11) = $137 million.
The other side of the equation, the alleged $11 cost of a fire-prevention device, is also a misleading estimation. One document that was not sent to Washington by Ford was a "Confidential" cost analysis Mother Jones has managed to obtain, showing that crash fires could be largely prevented for considerably less than $11 a car. The cheapest method involves placing a heavy rubber bladder inside the gas tank to keep the fuel from spilling if the tank ruptures. Goodyear had developed the bladder and had demonstrated it to the automotive industry. Ford Motor Company ran a rear-end crash test on a car with the rubber bladder in the gas tank. The tank ruptured, but no fuel leaked. On January 15, 1971, Ford again tested the bladder and again it worked. The total purchase and installation cost of the bladder would have been $5.08 per car. That $5.08 could have saved the lives several hundred people.
In February of 1978, a California jury created a nationwide sensation when it awarded the record-breaking sum of $128 million in a lawsuit stemming from a into accident (Weinberger Romeo, 45). This one lawsuit was three times what Ford executives and engineers had estimated their final cost would be.
Safety
Strange as it may seem, the Department of Transportation (NHTSA's parent agency) didn't know whether or not this was true. So it contracted with several independent research groups to study auto fires. The studies took months, which was just what Ford wanted. In May 1978 the Department of Transportation announced that the Pinto fuel system had a "safety related defect" and called for a recall. Ford agreed, and on June 9, 1978 the company recalled 1.5 million Pintos.
The recall came too late to save Ford's reputation. Millions of dollars in lawsuits were filed and won against the automaker, including the largest personal injury judgment ever. And in the 1979 landmark case State of Indiana v. Ford Motor Co., Ford notoriously became the first American corporation ever indicted or prosecuted on criminal homicide charges. Though Ford was acquitted of reckless homicide in March 1980, the Pinto's reputation had plummeted disastrously; Ford ceased production of the car five months after the trial.
Federal crash-test footage shows the classic Pinto rear-end collision and fireball.
Ford's choice to not fix the gas tanks led to many preventable lawsuits. It incurred high costs from court decisions and a negative opinion from the consumers on one of its "best-selling" cars."
____________
FYYFF!!!
posted December 14, 2010 04:04 PM
no they SHOULD have recalled them. but they acted in the best interest of KHI, no other reason for the recall as my response above indicates.
let's get it back to reality here lol
____________
2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
posted December 14, 2010 04:21 PM
Edited By: Shane661 on 15 Dec 2010 00:22
Oh...this is mirrored in The Smack House? In that case, Steve and FBA...pull Fish's cock out of your mouth's. You are the only two stoking the fires in his other lame threads...
Sad...but expected, for two cock lover's like yourselves...
quote:President Semon "Bunky" Knudsen, whom henry ford II had hired away from general motors... success of the mustang
Bunky goes to Fla., sees 'The best damn garage in town' sign and now signs on Smokey Yunick as R&D race engineer. You know, "Bunky" as being the Iacocca of the, 'Fabulous Hudson Hornet" fame. That is where Smokey was told to hand out the race parts to anyone running a Hudson. Bunky is also known for the term, "Race on Sunday, Sell on Monday" being yes, a salesman with a corporate hook.
Bunky now takes off to pontiac. Guess who handed out parts to the pontiac 'wrecking crew?' When pontiac wanted to win daytona, who do you think won with last year's pontiac? Smokey.
Bunky darted around chevy, pontiac, H-I trucks, ford and of course hudson. Bunky brought a corvette designer to ford. And because Smokey was the first to call Bunky, "Boss" from the hudson days, the name stuck [by the insiders]. Bunky had Smokey in Fla. with a secret building paid for by corporate. Bunky was race oriented and with Smokey by his side in all those racing venues, you've see chevy/ford/hudson/pontiac/trans-am and more win races. It was Bunky and Smokey behind the scenes.
What they did next was to pen a mustank called the, "BOSS 302" for this new engine an shit. So, in dedication having the boss carry a few guys along, they named a car after Bunky as in recognition for putting a lot of cars on the map. And did Smokey give Fireball Roberts one of the pontiacs to go race in? He sure did. And do you know why? He saw 'fear' in Fireballs is no more balls left we hug the steering wheel all in fear now.
Dis is also known ass, "Seat Gap" foot on the floor bored flaggets you get out the car now slowpoke. Next Racer!
posted December 14, 2010 04:33 PM
whoa! all I said was KHI did it in the best interest of KHI not a candy-land answer sui\ch as some really beleive
and I'm not loyal to any one brand (as some of you are), I like and ride all brands. I have a Kawi in the garage.
the aprilia recall slamming was a big hit, maybe I need to pull up old threads. but boy-howdee if any criticism hits this forum towards KHI...even if its the bold Truth.
posted December 14, 2010 04:37 PM
Edited By: Shane661 on 15 Dec 2010 00:44
quote:whoa! all I said was KHI did it in the best interest of KHI not a candy-land answer sui\ch as some really beleive
and I'm not loyal to any one brand (as some of you are), I like and ride all brands. I have a Kawi in the garage.
the aprilia recall slamming was a big hit, maybe I need to pull up old threads. but boy-howdee if any criticism hits this forum towards KHI...even if its the bold Truth.
Dude, you're a fucking douche. I invite anyone to search your threads.
I have more bikes and 3 brands in the garage...you simply suck ass. Your post post count says it all...nothing of value and over 25k posts. Please...STFU.
posted December 14, 2010 04:44 PM
search away, you won't see me defending nor bashing any one brand. actually I'm not bashing Kawi, although i have a roll of bounty brand tissue if you feel the brand let you down that hard or opened itself up to criticism
____________
2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
posted December 14, 2010 04:45 PM
Edited By: Shane661 on 15 Dec 2010 00:48
quote:search away, you won't see me defending nor bashing any one brand. actually I'm not bashing Kawi, although i have a roll of bounty brand tissue if you feel the brand let you down that hard or opened itself up to criticism
You're a fag...and anyone who searches you will see that.
Be sure to look at this pics of this dork...and then look at the threads with all the women he beds. Closet homo, for sure...
It's not that you suck dick...it's that you try to hide it. Disgraceful.
posted December 14, 2010 05:31 PM
Edited By: FastestBusaAround on 15 Dec 2010 02:46
Shane - you're the dick here. Neither Steve nor I have our mouths on Fishes cock or vice versa. Fact is - what it is. You're just too much of a fanboy to offer any useful info. I have 2 ZX14's and a Connie in my garage now.
I'll explain it to you in moron terms because that's exactly what you are
-- They recalled the bikes - several tons and shiploads worth, because of a huge liability, one that they surely did the bean count on. You're just too fucking stupid to see that, because you obviously know little about business and the way these multinationals work. Your intelligence is far outweighed by your naivety and ignorance, this deduced from all of your nonsensical spew here about KHI . All you've proven, is how stupid you really are. You fucking blah blah blah here all day long, but your argument doesn't hold water. With all due respect, not that you deserve it, you're still a douchbag and a moron. Now, you can go fuck yourself - eat shit and die, but I still like you.
Oh - and you can take that fart-spewing-shit-eating moron, watthecu with you...another idiot who's 4 quarters short of a dollar - and even more cards short of a full deck. ____________
FYYFF!!!
posted December 14, 2010 11:34 PM
Man stuffs gotten ugly since I've been gone This zx10 thing is really stirring up the shit. I think things have gotten blown out of proportion a bit though. I believe kawi is recalling and buying back 10's to protect themselves AND their customers. I don't think they're a big evil corporation, but they are a big business, and are going to play by big business rules
And Shane, whats the deal with the starting of the vicious posts? You're better than that man
posted December 15, 2010 12:44 AM
Three pages now of speculation and argument. I really don't see how anyone can have an opinion on this until we know what the problem is - apart from should they stop sales or not. The answer to that has got to be an unequivocal YES.
____________
Candy Thunder Blue 2006 ZZR1400
Stock wheelbase
Max: 205.4 mph in 1.25 miles
2012 ZZR1400 in Golden Blazed Green
Brock CT Full System. etc
Max: 203.1 in 1 mile (so far)
Zone Head
addition to riding no rehab4me
Posts: 725
posted December 15, 2010 12:44 AM
I got one for all of yall..how about old Honda Goldwings 2002 and 03 models that are sitting in the show rooms as trade ins and that are for sale still have not had there frame recalls fixed...I was looking at them this year for a long distance and found out about the recall online..
____________
2008 Concours ABS 23k miles in a yr Sold
2009 R1 16k miles in a yr Sold
2005 Honda Goldwing..6k miles in 2 months ..Sold
2012 Concours ABS 5k in 1 month..Sold
2011 ZX 10r 2k in 1 month...Sold..
2012 ZX 10R ABS black and red 144 miles as of 4-23-2013 sold.
2013 F6B deluxe sold
Back to the 2012 Connie present
2014 Green and Black ZX14r ..Beast mode!! present.
posted December 15, 2010 06:21 AM
Edited By: Shane661 on 15 Dec 2010 14:36
quote:
And Shane, whats the deal with the starting of the vicious posts? You're better than that man
Can't I just lower myself to their level occasionally? I'm just fed up with some of the weasel's, liars, suck-ups, and hypocrites on this site.
It is funny...people getting banned, censored, or moderated for articulately stating their points..while other trolls can shit on threads left and right without even a peep heard.
As for the 10R issue, well as usual the glass is half-empty around here. All you hear about is all negative. No good tech info, no good photo coverage, no ride reports....nothing. Hell, Bikeland is saying they broke this story worldwide...when they first read it from kawpower in this thread, it seems. But the bottom is that 90% of what you read here is just a bunch of whining from people who probably wouldn't buy one anyway.
I come to this site because I am a Kawasaki enthusiast. I like Kawasaki's. If I wanted to read about people slamming the hell out of Kawasaki all day, I would go to a Busa site.
Needs a life
2012 14r In Blue and no Mods!
Posts: 5428
posted December 15, 2010 06:39 AM
quote:
quote:
And Shane, whats the deal with the starting of the vicious posts? You're better than that man
Can't I just lower myself to their level occasionally? I'm just fed up with some of the weasel's, liars, suck-ups, and hypocrites on this site.
It is funny...people getting banned, censored, or moderated for articulately stating their points..while other trolls can shit on threads left and right without even a peep heard.
As for the 10R issue, well as usual the glass is half-empty around here. All you hear about is all negative. No good tech info, no good photo coverage, no ride reports....nothing. Hell, Bikeland is saying they broke this story worldwide...when they first read it from kawpower in this thread, it seems. But the bottom is that 90% of what you read here is just a bunch of whining from people who probably wouldn't buy one anyway.
I come to this site because I am a Kawasaki enthusiast. I like Kawasaki's. If I wanted to read about people slamming the hell out of Kawasaki all day, I would go to a Busa site.
Shane
Actually Shane I'm on suzukihayabusa.org and I honestly can't remember the last person on that site slamming a Kawasaki. They have known over there that I had 14's and not one person said anything negitive. it's alot better site then you think and they even created a section for the zx 14 but not much action because alot of you guys on here have not went over there. just saying
HOME
NEW TOPIC
posted December 14, 2010 03:10 PM
Edited By: 
This zx10 thing is really stirring up the shit. I think things have gotten blown out of proportion a bit though. I believe kawi is recalling and buying back 10's to protect themselves AND their customers. I don't think they're a big evil corporation, but they are a big business, and are going to play by big business rules 
