posted September 02, 2002 02:38 PM
Power Commanders Dyno Jet should sell Power Commanders in packs of three. One for the bike, one in the mail back to be fixed and another in the mail coming from Dyno Jet after repair.
The basic theory of, one coming, one going and one in use.
I am sorry, there is something wrong with the product. And regardless of the BS excuses, and the we didn't find anything wrong with it.... but here is a new one to replace the one sent back to us something needs to be done. I have put less then 2500 miles on three power commanders. I would consider this more of a defect then Fish's issue with the 12's clutch. The clutch is a wear item where as the Power Commander is susposed to be a long term product.
I am extremely glad that we (Performance Dyno) don't sell the damn things. We would need a full time shipping agent and attorney to handle the friggin warranty issues.The Yosh EMS system is looking better all the time. The Muzzy EMS looks cool, but the install is nuts.
____________
To those who do not count their life in years, but in how life
has touched them in the past and how much it can hold in the
future; -- Youth is forever.
posted September 02, 2002 03:45 PM
yes.
____________
To those who do not count their life in years, but in how life
has touched them in the past and how much it can hold in the
future; -- Youth is forever.
posted September 02, 2002 04:24 PM
My Pc-111 took a shit awhile back and I'm not buying another Dynojunk product.
____________
"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways- Body thoroughly used up, totally worn out...Screaming "WOO HOO, What a Ride !!!"
posted September 02, 2002 04:25 PM
I have an 02 installed yosh ems and had nothing but problems after installation. f1 light never cut off and ran very bad. Called yosh tolod me to send unit back. Installed pc3r had it tuned on dyno 175hp no problems so far. Dont no if ems is proven yet. May have just as many problems as pc
Needs a life
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Posts: One MEEEEEELLION
posted September 02, 2002 05:32 PM
The Yosh box is fairly pricey, it's true. But it's basically the same install as the PC III, so most guys can handle it.
posted September 02, 2002 06:59 PM
Well maybe its time for a collective collaboration between all the boards (ZX12, Busa, TLR, R1, etc) to take a survey of how many DJ customers have had to return or had problems with their product. Can you say class action lawsuit?
Heres another issue. A friend of mine purchases the product, we install it and then the bike has troubles starting. Sometimes the starter clutch kicks back.
Unplug the PC3 and problem solved.
____________
Official Charter Member of the RIDERS OF KAWASAKI MEMBERSHIP REVOCATION CLUB
Also a BadAss Internet Forum Moderator 4 Hire!! Come at me brah!
posted September 02, 2002 07:43 PM
This is the first time we have had that complaint!!! This is DJ's response when you ask about the problems with the PC111R's and starting issues.. I have been fighting to get this fixed for almost 10 months... and after 2 PC111R's it is the same old shit.. It can't be our Power Commander..
If this is so, why then does the problem go away when you disconnect the PC???
I really think they can't find the problems, or they have found them but either can't or will not fix them...
Class action... where do I sign up???
Needs a life
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Posts: One MEEEEEELLION
posted September 03, 2002 04:46 AM
Edited By: swft on 3 Sep 2002 05:47
ZHooligan - Have you had any probs starting the bike since removing the Power Commander? I know I wasn't the only one with the starter gear kicking back, so I'd be interested in hearing!
And maybe the Techlusion box is a better deal. I have yet to see one in the flesh, but the price is certainly right!
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posted September 03, 2002 05:29 AM
Well, maybe this winter, I'll convert the roadrace bike to Muzzy EMS. Hell, I've got the connector, I could actually just build my own harness. But $200 is a pretty good deal from Muzzy's for the harness, actually. Then again, I could prolly make it happen pretty quick if I wanted to chop up the stock harness.
Let's go check Ron Ayers:
Part Number: 26030-1677
Description: HARNESS,MAIN
Price: $301.06
Part Number: 26030-1752
Description: HARNESS,SUB
Price: $39.03
Part Number: 26030-1680
Description: HARNESS
Price: $133.80
Hmm...This would *not* be cheap! Basically, I'd be spending $460 just to get the connectors...
posted September 03, 2002 09:13 AM
First things first. Fish for the record I did sign the clutch petition. As for being rich that's a good one. I beleive the correct response using a quote from one of the Star Trek next generation shows, "Make it so #1". That way I would actually be rich.
Swft... The bike starts fine without the powercommander. Even hot. It ran like a raped ape home from the shop. Just worried about what is happening in the top end of the rpm band without something adding fuel etc.
Regarding the MUZZY EMS system it looks cool and so far seems to work well on Swfts bike. Muzzy claims it to be a plug and play unit. Which it is not at least from what I have seen.
Rob Muzzy posted a couple weeks back I beleive that they had the complete system available. But as of yet I have seen nothing on their web site. Muzzy's web site does not show anything different then has been on the site for months. They are still advertising a unit that works with the stick coils. Which it does not. If there is something available different then what was sent to Swft, it would be nice if Muzzy could update their web site.
Based on Swfts intallation, I have had some lengthy conversations with Swft and MVR whom helped Swft with the installation. Based on their experience, I have been quoted $1,200 to install the "plug and play" Muzzy EMS system. couple that with about $1,800 to buy the Muzzy EMS, the harness, the coils, wires, and sensors to make the thing closed loop, it becomes a $3,000 investment. Pretty significant outlay of cash.
The question then comes to mind is reliability and lifespan of the unit. Presently for about $300 you can buy a Power Commander that needs to be replaced with about each oil change. In my case I have had two units go bad in 2500 miles. The feed back on this board on the Yosh box is not overwhelming either. In the for what it is worth catagory, I have also had intimate experience with the $1,000 HRC ignition box and $1,000 HRC ignition harness for the RC51 that were total failures. So thus the dilema. The reality is I am looking for an ignition system that works, will take care of my bike and allow me to ride it.
Thats about all I can say at the moment. I need to go count my millions. This has become significantly more difficult since my wife fixed the holes in my socks.
____________
To those who do not count their life in years, but in how life
has touched them in the past and how much it can hold in the
future; -- Youth is forever.
posted September 04, 2002 09:54 PM
It is interesting to hear about others and their problem with the starting issue. My bike starts like a champ without the Power Commander hooked up whether hot or cold. It won't start with the Power Commander hooked up and the engine warm. It barely turns over and the starter on occasion kicks back. We found that by retarding the timing 4 degrees in the zero throttle position that it will start about 75% of the time. Disconnect the Power Commander and boom it starts. Of course I guess it is not a reasonable thing to associate the problem with the Power Commander??
____________
To those who do not count their life in years, but in how life
has touched them in the past and how much it can hold in the
future; -- Youth is forever.
posted September 05, 2002 03:15 AM
Well, Ive had a few issues with the PC3 and 3r, but none have forced me to return it yet.
I feel bad, because I recommmended the 3R to a friend and now he is having the *starter kick back issues*. Although whats odd is, while the bike is running I retarded the timinig in the first 3 cells and the idle quality improved dramatically! The PC does respond to changes when uploaded via my laptop, but I cant figure out why it would be kicking the starter back issues unless the signal delay is getting increased somehow.
____________
Official Charter Member of the RIDERS OF KAWASAKI MEMBERSHIP REVOCATION CLUB
Also a BadAss Internet Forum Moderator 4 Hire!! Come at me brah!
posted September 05, 2002 07:19 AM
I'm putting my Yosh EMS on today. I will have some more feedback on that system after some riding. Scrapped the Dynojet piece. Bike ran better without it anyway!!
____________
RED NINJAS RULE!!
posted September 05, 2002 07:43 AM
I too have had to send back my PCIII and now it is disconnected because I don't trust it.
For your information I checked the ouput signals vs. the input signals on the PC with an O scope. I can tell you this with "0"s in the cells the pulse lengths are waaay different when they should be the same. How much would anyone like to bet that with the PC3r the timing is just as skewed? The whole thing is a hack job.
____________
Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
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Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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posted September 05, 2002 09:29 AM
I have a funny feeling that the Yosh box wouldn't fare any better. Damn, I wish there was a way to get into the stock ECU and reprogram it! As it is, the Muzzy EMS is prolly the only viable real solution for a severly modded bike. This is one reason that I'm not in the least interested in modding another bike to the extent that I've gone with both of my ZX12Rs. Talk about your law of diminishing returns!
posted September 05, 2002 09:43 AM
My first PCIIIR went bad in the spring after about 250 miles. Same old same old from Dynojet when I called them. Sent it back and they said the first couple of times they tested it it was fine, but then they finally got it to act up. They sent me a new one (I know because I strategically marked the old one to be sure) and it had a different part number than the original. I've put 7,000 miles on this one with no problems but you know I have tools to remove it on the road and am ready to shut the motor off at a moments notice of trouble.
My guess on the Yosh EMS is it IS manufactured by Dynojet. The similiarities are just too close!
posted September 05, 2002 03:04 PM
The "stick coil" issue is totally my fault. I meant to have that removed and between me and our graphics guy, forgot. It's gone now. We will spcify and supply the correct coils.
Swft got the very first harness we released. There have been many "tweaks" since then (there always are) and it should be as easy as promised now. Having said that, There are still a couple of connections that are not "plug" but nothing that should be difficult. I'm working on a complete set of instructions which will make it pretty clear.
Doug
____________
It's not that I think you're dumb, it's just that so much of what you know isn't true....
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posted September 06, 2002 02:06 AM
During and after the EMS install, I had given some feedback to Muzzys regarding the harness. Personally, I did not find the install to be real hard, once I had the info I needed (big thanks to Doug and Richard and Rob for their help). Took the bike over to the dyno today for some prelimiary tuning, and I think I have a long way to go to get back to the power levels I was seeing with the stock computer and a PC3R. I think I'm seeing a very lean condition anywhere over 3k rpm, but I might be having an equipment issue with the DJ250, as well. *shrug* This shit always comes up as the dates for Bonneville get closer. ____________
82 Gpz750, 84 Ninja 900, 2000 ZX12R (Muzzy Big Bore Kit), *another* 2000 ZX12R (Muzzy custom stroke crank 1341cc motor), 2004 ZZR1200, 2005 ZX10R, 2007 ZX14, 2008 Concours 14, 2014 Versys 650, 2014 Yamaha WR450F, 2015 Ninja H2
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posted September 02, 2002 02:38 PM
posted September 02, 2002 07:43 PM
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