fish_antlers
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posted August 13, 2002 02:17 PM
A letter to Roadracers from a CHP officer...
Originally posted at Labusas...
Thought I would re-post it here as it is makes me think of some of the members I have ridden with and the need for us t0 keep the racing on the track and NOT on the street...
http://venus.13x.com/roadracingworld/scripts/NewsInsert.asp?insert=3947
quote:
8/12/2002
Words Of Advice From A CHP Motorcycle Officer
Copyright 2002, Roadracing World Publishing, Inc.
This just in, via e-mail:
To the readers of this magazine:
I'm a CHP motor officer. Yesterday, I had to respond to a motorcycle collision on Glendora Ridge Rd. The dispatcher said it was a motorcycle verses a sheriff's vehicle. When I arrived, I was painfully greeted with the sight of a totaled Ford Bronco, a broken 955 Daytona, and a dead young man in his full leathers and boots.
He had been video taping himself with front and rear fairing mounted cameras. From the footage, I was able to clearly see that he had been hitting all of his apexes. He was a decent rider who knew the road quite well. He wasn't riding overly fast and wasn't stunting. Just out for a ride on a Sunday Morning.
Here lies the fatal mistake. The apexes that he was hitting, were on both the right and left side of the roadway. The last corner he saw was a left hander. It was a blind left hander. Unfortunately for him, a Los Angeles County Sheriff's Bronco was coming up the hill in the opposite direction. The Sheriff was as far to the right as he could get before scraping the rock wall next to his right.
According to witness statements, the motorcycle rider was on the wrong side of the road and almost at the apex of this blind left hander, when he saw the Bronco appear. He was headed straight for the hood of the truck. The rider straightened the bike upright and got on the binders hard enough to go into a stoppie. Both he and the bike ended up on the roof of the Bronco and then slid back in front of it and onto the ground when the Sheriff stopped.
The two Sheriffs who were in the Bronco, tried for 15 minutes, until the life flight arrived with a paramedic. They were unsuccessful to save his life. He probably died the instant his chest hit the Bronco's push bumper. The actual cause of death is still pending the coroner's report.
Speed was not much of a contributing factor in this collision. The Daytona was probably traveling 40 to 50 mph and the Bronco was 20 to 25 mph. That's a closing rate of 60 to 75 mph. With only 40 feet of visibility due to the rock wall on the inside of the corner, he did not have a chance to slow or swerve enough to avoid the collision.
It's a very unfortunate thing that happened and a mistake that alot of us have made (me included). We are still here to talk about it though. Humans tend to learn from mistakes. Let's learn from other's mistakes before we have to learn the hard way! Don't make me respond to the scene of your collision and find you on the ground as I had to yesterday. I'm not trying to tell you to quit having fun with your motorcycle. I get on my 2000 gixer 750 and ride hard too! Just think about the consequences and give yourself plenty of room to react to your mistakes and the mistakes of those you might encounter.
California Highway Patrol Motor Officer,
C. L. Gramm #15980
   
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zx12rpilot
Expert Class
Posts: 120
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posted August 13, 2002 06:12 PM
Amen, cop brother!
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beansbaxter
Needs a life
Posts: 5911
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posted August 13, 2002 07:31 PM
That's good preachin'
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Dino
Pro
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posted August 13, 2002 08:10 PM
Fish, who do you ride with that goes over the center line? (and remind me not to ride with them!) I agree this is a sad story,and I might get flamed for my response,BUT, people that ride like idiots and don't wear their helmets,etc.,..IMHO...are pushing their luck further than they should be and I find it hard to have a lot of sympathy(although I DO)for them. I'm not a cold hearted s.o.b. ..I lost the only riding buddy I had for years because he went out riding like an idiot(I made a detailed account a couple years ago) after I I.D."d him ,and my initial OH MY GOD..etc,...I called him a dumb fucker,stupid shit...and so on.....HE PISSED ME OFF!! I still twweak thinking about how he SHOULD still be here enjoying the rides with me and it's just not right..ok that's enough....I'll shut up now and hope nobody takes this the wrong way.
____________
uh oh
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ZHooligan
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posted August 13, 2002 08:15 PM
Dino,
It is all part of Darwins theory. And the guys you are talking about are bad for the gene pool!!
Butt at least the letter was a good one from the officer. And pointed out what happened.
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To those who do not count their life in years, but in how life
has touched them in the past and how much it can hold in the
future; -- Youth is forever.
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TedG
Moderator
Posts: 8222
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posted August 13, 2002 09:03 PM
I have to say this. Going aroung a blind turn with any part of you or the motorcycle over the center line is just plain asking to die. Around a blind turn I take the clean stripe as far away as I can possibly be away from the other lane. It may not be the fastest way through the corner but I don't care to throw away my life to save a few fractions of a second on the street. Although not going fast and wearing protection, this guy was as unsafe as any speeding, unprotected rider. IMHO
____________
Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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22348bCVC
Zone Head
Posts: 798
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posted August 13, 2002 10:45 PM
quote:
It's a very unfortunate thing that happened and a mistake that alot of us have made (me included). We are still here to talk about it though. Humans tend to learn from mistakes. Let's learn from other's mistakes before we have to learn the hard way! Don't make me respond to the scene of your collision and find you on the ground as I had to yesterday. I'm not trying to tell you to quit having fun with your motorcycle. I get on my 2000 gixer 750 and ride hard too! Just think about the consequences and give yourself plenty of room to react to your mistakes and the mistakes of those you might encounter.
California Highway Patrol Motor Officer,
C. L. Gramm #15980
AMEN, brotherman!!!
____________
...just relax...my dog wants to use only one of your legs...
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ZXtra
Expert Class
Posts: 490
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posted August 13, 2002 11:55 PM
My left turn apexes are on the right side of the center line.
Thanks for the post! -ZXtra
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The sixth sick sheik's sixth sheep's sick!
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fish_antlers
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posted August 14, 2002 07:03 AM
Dino.... I'm pretty sure that the guy in the letter was wearing full leathers/gear... not a squid... and yes you do happen to take blind corners "hot" leaning into oncoming traffic... remember that I'm the guy behind you who's watching you and cringing (sp?) .. this brings me back to my point that we all need to "take it down a notch" and that the racetrack is a far far better place to open it up and see what the bike can do.. there are no cops, street signs, curbs etc etc to contend with, not to mention dumptrucks etc... my whole point on the last trip to laguna after worm_hole went down... it's the same as racing... a DNF (did not finish) doesnt count.... you've got lots of miles to cover and lots of scenery to see.... get there and back alive.... if you want to turn it up a notch, pay yer 50 bucks and hit the track where they have EMS etc standing by incase you fuck up.
my $2 werth
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22348bCVC
Zone Head
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posted August 14, 2002 09:38 AM
 Edited By: 22348bCVC on 14 Aug 2002 10:40
...you make a good point, but to clarify, I didn't think I was being rickyracer and I AM probably the slowest, most conservative rider out there (just ask the other riders whom I regularly ride with...not willing to take many chances) and my point of departure from the road was from the right side of my centerline in my own lane on a decreasing radius curve ...I still dunno how it happened, but I do know that I was probably leaned over a bit too much for the relative low speed that I was actually doing (if that makes any sense at all) and that perhaps other combos (lack of concentration comes to mind) contributed to me worm~holin' on that hot asphalt...you make a good point, tho, cuz I DO take my chances up on my favorite familiar mountain (but didn't on the unfamiliar roads of the last Laguna trip) and I will turn it down a notch or two the next times I head on up there...life is good when you're above the ground...to get there first, you must first get there...
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...just relax...my dog wants to use only one of your legs...
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fish_antlers
Administrator
The Truth is Out There
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posted August 14, 2002 09:47 AM
actually I wanted to talk to you about yer crash... I saw Nicky Hadden go down in the AMA race on sunday... he lost it exactly like you did, similar corner... seems as though the front lost it for no reason whatsoever, but when you looked at in in slow mo you could see what happened... suspension completely compressed from going around super tight slow corner... bike hit slight uneven part of paveent and suspension had no more play in it.... have you set up yer front suspension etc on yer bike? crash was eerily (sp?) similar to yers... if you happen to see it on Speed check it out... AMA Superbike race.... actually I'll give you a call on the weekend when I'm off werk to talk about it... lus bike spun around EXACTLY like yers and similar damage... that it until it hit a burm, flipped over, and then burnt down  ... but hey... he had an extra RC51 just incase! Must be nice!
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22348bCVC
Zone Head
Posts: 798
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posted August 14, 2002 10:19 AM
Edited By: 22348bCVC on 14 Aug 2002 11:32
...yeah, I saw the race...and but for a moment, Nicky and I were a cosmic rider of one (insert sparkly worm~hole dream sequence here)...must be indeed nice to have spare bikes and have all the chics dig you...  ...Hey! check username is 'gerd'...he signed up this past saturday when I visited him at his house...guess who?...I'll tell you when we talk if you haven't already guessed or read it before I edited this post...
____________
...just relax...my dog wants to use only one of your legs...
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swft
Needs a life
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posted August 14, 2002 04:21 PM
You know, that's not a letter to roadracers...Roadracers are the guys to are smart enough to do the corner apexes on the left side of the road at the track! Naw, a more appropriate term for those kind of riders is wormdirt
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eddynasty
Novice Class
Posts: 89
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posted August 14, 2002 04:38 PM
Meanwhile>>>
50,000 stupid assholes were killed in car accidents! Why highlight motorcyclist?
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slug
Pro
Out in search of my mind...
Posts: 1433
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posted August 14, 2002 05:10 PM
because we are public enemy #1
i think it is because people are jealous,and not ballsy enoughy to get their own bike, and resent us olur freedom of movement, performance, and agility at fraction of the cost of a mediocre car
i mean come ON my 7000 dollar bike outperforms most vehicular machinery that costs up to about 35-40k. granted above that you get into exotica, but hey, jim bob and his twin sister/wife jolene in their 78 corvette get awful mad about being whupped by streetsquid on a 600cc bike ;P
  
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22348bCVC
Zone Head
Posts: 798
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posted August 14, 2002 10:00 PM
quote:
You know, that's not a letter to roadracers...Roadracers are the guys to are smart enough to do the corner apexes on the left side of the road at the track! Naw, a more appropriate term for those kind of riders is wormdirt
was that for me???...if it was, let me just say that I started my entry from the right edge of the road and started riding towards the center of my own lane as the radius decreased...I was still on the hi-side of my lane when I low-sided off into the run-off...I haven't done track-days yet, nor am I as experienced as you at hi-speeds and curves, but I think I know which line to take on an unfamiliar twisty road...I'm that kind of rider...
____________
...just relax...my dog wants to use only one of your legs...
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EastBayDave
Needs a job
Posts: 2245
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posted August 15, 2002 05:21 AM
saw Nicky's crash, I coulda swore he was leanded over to the EXTREME edge of the tire, & when he cracked the throttle, pulled the front tire PAST the edge...zip = lowside.
If you've ever leaned far enuf to get off the edge of the tire, & know what that feels like, you understand.
____________
Enjoy the ride!
02' ZRX1200
00' ZX12R sold
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TeamSpeed
Expert Class
Posts: 449
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posted August 15, 2002 03:03 PM
CVC, I think I actually take the cake for the most conservative rider. Unless you got more than 7200 miles out of their original rear tire, I may just have you beat. Of course, this is really nothing to brag about, is it? Damn... 
The problem I have is that I only have one person I ride with, and that is few and far between. So there is nobody pushing me to be a bit harder on the bike, except myself. And in Indiana, you are hard pressed to even find a set of consecutive curves, damn corn rows everywhere making for straight roads.
We have a couple of colleges in this town, which makes for a bunch of bikers, alot of those squids. It seems that there is at least one wreck each weekend here. And you should see the stupid shi... crap that some of these guys are pulling with a girl on the back, not their girlfriends, just chicks that walk over and ask for a ride, and probably do not know how to ride at that. It is these guys that give the rest of us really bad names.
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22348bCVC
Zone Head
Posts: 798
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posted August 15, 2002 03:44 PM
yup about the squids in your necko the woods...I have 25,000 miles on this bike thru four sets of tires...lots of twisties...lots and lots of decreasing radius curves on my favorite mountains...a few thousand miles of interstate (but only for getting to motorcycle trip destinations expeditiously)...all told I have at least 200,000 with the four bikes I've owned...first 120,000 miles were in the southeast NC., SC., Tenn, Ark. many, many moons ago...60,000 in SoCal with my third bike...the rest and counting with this 12R....all relatively 'conservative' riding mixed with some 'spirited' forays when appropriate
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...just relax...my dog wants to use only one of your legs...
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swft
Needs a life
Full throttle!
Posts: One MEEEEEELLION
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posted August 15, 2002 06:37 PM
quote:
was that for me???...if it was, let me just say that I started my entry from the right edge of the road and started riding towards the center of my own lane as the radius decreased...I was still on the hi-side of my lane when I low-sided off into the run-off...I haven't done track-days yet, nor am I as experienced as you at hi-speeds and curves, but I think I know which line to take on an unfamiliar twisty road...I'm that kind of rider...
CVC - I would never impune your riding ability or style! With the exception of freek, all the board members I've meant are skilled, thoughtful riders! I was referring to the great generic group of squids out there...
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TedG
Moderator
Posts: 8222
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posted August 15, 2002 08:41 PM
quote:
yup about the squids in your necko the woods...I have 25,000 miles on this bike thru four sets of tires...lots of twisties...
Are you kidding me?? I too have 25,000 (actually 26 now) and I just had my 14th set of tires delivered. How do you get such good milage??
____________
Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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ZHooligan
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posted August 15, 2002 08:59 PM
Now Ted you know if you were buying those BT010's you would get that many liles on a set! Right!!!
This thread just reminds me of a couple of things I've le3arned over the years. First most guys who crash, crashed because of things, actions and or other people outside of their control. In other words not their fault. The other thing I am reminded of in this thread is that about 99% of the time I and other people crash because we are riding over our head at that particular moment. And the unfortunate guy in the CHP story I am certain if the it were possible to ask him he would be quick to point out that the dude driving the car crossed over into his lane and hit him!!
The facts are simple, if you ride you will crash, if you havn't crashed you will eventually, and if you already have you will again! I have never been nearly hit or cut off by a car that I was not actually in eye contact with the driver either face to face or in the mirror. They do see us most of the time and they rely on us to move. That doies not excuse our actions and behavior. On any given Saturday or Sunday while riding with the guys I can honestley say that I will see a number of things occur that could result in an accident.
The longer you ride, and the more experience you have translates into bigger and more serious accidents. Confidence and experience does not eliminate accidents. That is why the best riders in the world crash and that is why they are spectacular crashes!
This is why everyone that rides needs to take a look at themselves and their riding behavior every once awhile. And beleive me, I am not exempt.
____________
To those who do not count their life in years, but in how life
has touched them in the past and how much it can hold in the
future; -- Youth is forever.
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22348bCVC
Zone Head
Posts: 798
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posted August 15, 2002 09:19 PM
TedG...no kidding...that's what I get...goes to show just how conservative I am with my riding style...no smokin' drives outta the corners, no wheelies...just one scared mofo respecting a very powerful bike and knowing his own skills and limits...and I replace fronts and rears together as soon as the wearbars on the rear start to get to the surface and by that time the fronts start to feather ...2 sets of 207s and 2 sets of 010s...and another new 010 set waiting in my bedroom...I'm kinda' 'poor', but I try to keep a fresh set on hand as tire sales present themselves.......
____________
...just relax...my dog wants to use only one of your legs...
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22348bCVC
Zone Head
Posts: 798
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posted August 15, 2002 09:28 PM
swtf...well, ok then...sure...
____________
...just relax...my dog wants to use only one of your legs...
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TedG
Moderator
Posts: 8222
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posted August 16, 2002 06:15 PM
quote:
Now Ted you know if you were buying those BT010's you would get that many liles on a set! Right!!!
The facts are simple, if you ride you will crash, if you havn't crashed you will eventually, and if you already have you will again!The longer you ride, and the more experience you have translates into bigger and more serious accidents. Confidence and experience does not eliminate accidents. That is why the best riders in the world crash and that is why they are spectacular crashes!
This is why everyone that rides needs to take a look at themselves and their riding behavior every once awhile. And beleive me, I am not exempt.
I am going to chime in again, Use Bridgestones and you will probably crash.
Now seriously, I have crashed but never on the street...never. Taken more horozontal trips to the hospital with red lights and sirens than anyone should in a lifetime. But only from a racetrack. 35 years of riding on the street (36 on Tuesday) and no crashes. Setup rules for yourself and never break them. Always have an escape route from any potentially dangerious situation. Learn to read the road, understand the available traction, don't panic when you slide. Know where to play and where to cool it. Never ride behind a squid without ample room, Don't fool with cars the people driving them are stupid and will do the stupidest thing possible. Usually a good place to get a ticket is a bad place to play. Remember never cross the center line except to pass and only when it is safe, it is not worth risking your life to pass a damn car. You can be safe and still be a maniac, it is just a matter of finding the right places. Remember there is always a car stradiling the center line around EVERY blind corner, always give him room. It is probably some drunken Harley rider giving his pile a ride home in the truck. Harley's love to ride in trucks. Only difference between them and a dog is the dog can get in and out by itself.
____________
Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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