blitzkrieg
Needs a job
Road kill = Free lunch.
Posts: 2044
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posted February 28, 2006 05:25 PM
Yup, getting everything off is the time consuming part for sure.
Like we talked about, the composite cover that holds the ignition wires and rubber heat blanket is almost impossible to remove without breaking if the upper motor mounts are in position.
Solution is to remove the upper-upper motor mount bolts and swing the mounts out of the way. It takes 10 seconds and will save you $54 because thats what that fucking little piece of plastic costs. 
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"BTW....You need to get a girlfriend who's last name isn't .jpg"
  
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speedgene
Zone Head
Posts: 996
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posted February 28, 2006 09:33 PM
 Edited By: speedgene on 1 Mar 2006 16:30
.007 is your spec on #3. Change both (#3 intake) shims to achieve .007.
Looks like #3 intake is walking the most. If you want to hit an .0075 - .008 on them, that still would make you within specs.
.0059 shows you are about to break-out within the running range... meaning .0058 is not far to go.
Hope you didn't put it back together yet? Better to do #3 in. shim change now than down the road... pull the head to fix a burnt valve.
The design of this engine runs at a certain valve lash. Say the lash is loose. The valve opens late. The initial movement of air starts slower. This packs less fuel/air in the chamber, restricting the potential of the engine. Since the timing narrows, this tends to fire part of the fuel. The fuel turns to carbon, then clings to the seat, and valve face. The valve begins to cool too much (loose valve lash) because it's sitting on the seat too long. Carbon can't get hot enough to burn off. This carbon coating builds on the valve and seats. This layer will add to the (loose) valve lash. Now you have carbon glowing at spots on the valve and seat. The glow is so hot, that some metal from the seat and valve face evaporate from the excess heat. You can literally see the contact points burned away where the carbon glowed. The (now welded) metals are broken apart when the valve opens, and moves away from the seat.
Another variable that sometimes gets missed is the spring load on the cam. This can push the cam toward the cam tower cover. There is almost a .001" loss of valve lift when the cam compresses into the cam caps. There you have less valve opening happening with a loose valve.
You need to stay on top of the valve lash when they are loose, or tight. Stay in the middle of the spec range. Hope this helped?
Blitz helped me with a correction. TY Blitz.
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E-tard
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blitzkrieg
Needs a job
Road kill = Free lunch.
Posts: 2044
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posted February 28, 2006 11:22 PM
Do you want to re-read what you posted above and correct it, Gene?
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"BTW....You need to get a girlfriend who's last name isn't .jpg"
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supra5677
Pro
Posts: 1279
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posted March 02, 2006 09:40 AM
Cool pics dude. I have the exact same leak on my 02. must be common on this bike.
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supra5677
Pro
Posts: 1279
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posted March 02, 2006 09:43 AM
btw..my buddy has a kick as 00 12r. He recommends adjusting to the loose side of the spec.
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blitzkrieg
Needs a job
Road kill = Free lunch.
Posts: 2044
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posted March 02, 2006 03:47 PM
quote:
btw..my buddy has a kick as 00 12r. He recommends adjusting to the loose side of the spec.
I run them on the loose side because:
1) Doing them is not the most fun thing I can think of
2) As the valvetrain wears clearances decrease.
There is a valid (but probably splitting hairs on a street driven bike) argument that by having them just inside the tight side you are going to maximize HP, but personally I seriously doubt you could even get the amount to register on a dyno.
Of course that debate is as old as the "which oil is best" debate and you know how that goes. 
My experience (personally and from others) is that the big change in clearance occurs in the first couple of thousand miles and after that there is very little wear. As an example OldKneeDragger has about 90K miles on his 12 and I believe he said after the initial shim change he has not had to adjust them again.
I did the valves on my A1 last June at roughly 12K miles and I have no intention of even checking them again until 30K miles.
To throw a little irony into the discussion, my new R1 does not even need an inspection of the clearance until 26.6K miles and the same thereafter.
My experience doing the shims on 12's tells me that Kawasaki's 7.5K interval is waaaaaaay overkill. 12K would be more apropos.
Another thing you have to beware of is I have heard (from reliable sources) that some dealers merely run a leakdown test to determine if the valve clearance is good. That really bothers me.
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"BTW....You need to get a girlfriend who's last name isn't .jpg"
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gunner
Needs a life
Posts: 5778
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posted March 02, 2006 08:54 PM
quote:
Another thing you have to beware of is I have heard (from reliable sources) that some dealers merely run a leakdown test to determine if the valve clearance is good. That really bothers me.
Hell Blitz I would be surprised if 75% of the dealers even have a leakdown tester. I'll just about BET a compression tester is all most of them have, and at that they probably think that's a leakdown test. Morons Most of them don't even have a clue what a piston stop is and what it's used for.
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blitzkrieg
Needs a job
Road kill = Free lunch.
Posts: 2044
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posted March 02, 2006 09:45 PM
Agreed Gunner.
Thats why my bikes (and my friends for that matter) never see a dealer service bay.
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"BTW....You need to get a girlfriend who's last name isn't .jpg"
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tuusinii
Pro
Posts: 1031
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posted March 02, 2006 11:50 PM
Loose end is better! And when You think of it the difference between middle and loose end is 5 1/100 mm. So when the valve lift is in the region of 15mm (figure out of my head) it really dosen't make any difference for the power output, but may make Your engine last longer.
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OutsiderzX12r
Zone Head
Street Racer
Posts: 841
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posted March 03, 2006 06:48 AM
quote:
Agreed Gunner.
Thats why my bikes (and my friends for that matter) never see a dealer service bay.
Thanks Bro. 
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OutsiderZX12R
2000 ZX12R-A1
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RAC4IT
Needs a job
Bergie
Posts: 3009
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posted March 03, 2006 08:50 AM
Good post.
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in the beginning
Parking Attendant
Posts: 6
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posted March 14, 2009 11:43 AM
Hi,Blitz. looks like its an old thread but could you send me a copy or your valve adjust tutorial.
littleac@platinum.ca
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If a fat old guy can do this what's your excuse?
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted March 14, 2009 07:55 PM
i have not done this to my 12 and may never do it cause of the pain in the ass to check valves but i ran my zx11c at .004 to .006". it was assembled loose say .012 on everything. i rode it like that almost 1500mi to make sure the valves were not going to move (the bad seats thing). then i tightened them up and got about .15 in the 1/4 you could see with some mph. you are not looking so much at valve lift in a hp increase but a bit of duration. my duster i went .004 tight for a while and it slowed down (cam was already too much duration) then went .008 the other way(.004 loose) and got .2 out of the .008 difference.
which confermed the cam being too much duration already (was 285@.050)
i am not saying this will work for all but i mess with cam adjustment on a car all the time though i know it is eaiser.
it would be a pain on the 12 at .004 to .006 i think cause i checked the clearence on the 11 atleast every 1000 mi. and would want to do it the same on the 12.
so i agree on going to the tightest in spec setting for max gain but i would then check clearence sooner than 7500 mi. like 3000.
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ted040
Parking Attendant
Posts: 11
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posted March 14, 2009 09:46 PM
Girthy, can you do me a favor.....
tell me how your throttle bodies are connected via the vacuum lines..
I have all mine apart and forgot how they go ?????
Please tell me if this is right....,,,,, All 4 throttle bodies have 2 vacuum ports on the top of them. I believe that all the left vacuum ports are connected togethor and then goto the intake air sensor then tee off to the fuel pressure regulator..
The right vacuum ports are connected how ????
Thanks for all your help......Ted
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shiggsy
Expert Class
Posts: 128
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posted March 15, 2009 02:19 AM
The right ports need to be blanked off apart from the one on the throttle body where the throttle cables attach. That one is connected to the vapour canister by the rear brake fluid container.
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tuusinii
Pro
Posts: 1031
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posted March 15, 2009 09:32 PM
I find it easier to check the valves on 12 than on 11, because You don't need to remove airbox, carbs, fuel tank, fuel tank hoses etc... Yes it is a little tight but You have alle the room You need. And also when adjusting the throttle bodies You don't need to feed the fuel by hand as the fuel tank is always connected. I find all this talk about ZX12 being a nigthmare to service very amysing and only coming from those who don't know.
PS Yes the battery is hard place.. (but I have had to change it only one time during 10 years!)
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted March 16, 2009 05:43 AM
i will agree an the checking part. i was dissapointed with my self on amm the bitching to get started. then when it was done it was not that bad. but shim changing is something else. i had my 11 down to a fast easy setup.
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tuusinii
Pro
Posts: 1031
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posted March 18, 2009 02:06 AM
Yes that is true changing shims on ZX11 is like 2 minute job! Not so easy on ZX12 because You have to remove the cams. But usually it's also not that bad as You don't need to remove them completely (unless it's the camchain side). Lot of bolts and time though...
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whitehendrix
Zone Head
fails!
Posts: 757
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posted March 20, 2009 11:41 PM
i'm another fan on keep shit on the loose side.. thermal expansion will cause problems if they're too tight, as well as having constant stress on the component and accelerated wear.
sometimes i wish they were all threaded tappet style.. just soo much easier to adjust.
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Duct tape is the handyman's secret
weapon. The black is for formal
occasions. - ZRXDean
ill never own a busa unless
someone gives me one.... and then
ill sell it -KZScott
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dougmeyer
Needs a job
moderated
Posts: 2713
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posted March 22, 2009 07:14 PM
You guys may find my post on this topic on this page of interest:
http://www.bikeland.org/board/viewthread.php?FID=13&TID=45825&set_time=
Doug
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It's not that I think you're dumb, it's just that so much of what you know isn't true....
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