ninja12
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Posts: 3310
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posted December 09, 2005 01:47 PM
Poll Question:
POLICE FRIEND OR FOE
Do you truly believe that the man in blue is a friend to you.
Are you happy to see a cop you didn't call?
Poll Results:
 16 votes (53%)
No
14 votes (47%)
yes
  
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zx12richard
Pro
The Green Monster..
Posts: 1133
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posted December 09, 2005 01:56 PM
I will say what I always say...
Cops are people too, there are good ones and there are dicks....... I can't answer just yes or no it wouldn't be an honest opinion...
I would say most are decent but, there are dicks out there just looking to make it harder for you than need to be...
Like the ones for example pulled me over cause they seen me leave a bar parking lot... Surprise I don't drink and drive... They was just trying to be dicks....
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12r1
Expert Class
Posts: 390
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posted December 09, 2005 02:53 PM
I can't vote either, as I've experienced both the good and the bad cops.It's a crap shoot when you see the lights behind you. Will he f--k me, or be reasonable?
I've had a complete car search for being stopped for a dirty tag. A few other examples, too.
I've also gotten breaks, like "if you wanna fly, go up the country and fly", front wheel in the air on my 'ol Eliminator, showin' of in town.
jeff
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trenace
Needs a job
Posts: 3056
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posted December 09, 2005 04:33 PM
 Edited By: trenace on 9 Dec 2005 17:46
There's no one "yes/no" answer: my best answer is that I have personally experienced only ONE cop that ever really screwed me over in any way (wrote me three tickets all completely bogus, then took my license, only way to get it back was to pay the tickets and then drive back to the police station with the receipt: this was in Puerto Rico 25 years ago.)
I've been written a number of tickets that were for bullshit violations -- violations that in no way represented bad or unsafe driving or riding to anybody -- but were the law, so the fault is the law not the cop.
I have had a lot of cops not write me for the full extent of actual violation or not all actual violations. Other than the above, never had false charges or undue harassment -- well there was the time I was cuffed and stuffed for telling a cop running a broken-red-light scam that what he was doing was wrong, but he was non-violent, not too bad a guy.
Generally speaking, the great majority of non-traffic cops are indeed helping society.
The traffic cops are really more of a revenue collection agency that arbitrarily doesn't collect some fraction of the time, and corruptly (IMO) exempts itself from the law it enforces on most others. So I don't have a really positive opinion of traffic cops however the majority of them are I think good guys in a job that society has stupidly set up to collect revenue for things that shouldn't be violations. Oddly enough I think the answer is that enforcement should instead be absolute: When, and only when, Joe Politician and even moreso Joe Cop get a ticket EVERY FUCKING TIME a cop spots them going 57 in a 55, regardless that it's out in the middle of nowhere, no traffic, dead straight perfect road that would be good for one hundred and fifty five, you will see the laws change. Regardless of having gotten breaks myself (less than half the time) I would rather the system have none of this "I am the law!" where the cop arbitrarily lets off whoever he wants (including all of his cop buddies, "you scratch my back I'll scratch yours") because it's only due to that system that various bullshit traffic laws are tolerated let alone ever in place in the first place. The cops know they won't be ticketed for violating them (I have personally known one cop though that personally really did obey speed laws religiously everywhere, so there are some exceptions) because of corruption -- excuse me "professional courtesy" -- and the politicians know they won't either, for same reason. And the public doesn't demand change as strongly either because of the "maybe I'll get a break" factor.
Corruption is insidious and allows things to continue that should not, and a lot of the speed laws and how they're selectively enforced, and how cops excuse themselves from the law in cases they absolutely would enforce on noncops, nonpoliticians, non-other-group-the-cop-personally-decided-was-exempt-from-the-law -- are a perfect example of that.
Actually this principle goes back a hell of a long way -- the English Common law was that if you could prove that the law was enforced selectively, that the sheriff, etc chose to excuse others from it -- that was an automatic win for the defense. And that's the way it should be. If another person, e.g. a cop, should not be fined for the same speed in the same conditions then neither should you. No bullshit "discretion" as to who is exempt from the law and who gets nailed. That is the stuff of corruption. True, honest discretion is as to whether the law in fact has been violated or appears strongly enough to have been violated to merit the charge -- not whether the person falls into a favorite group, like one of your coworkers, and therefore is exempt while another is not in one of your favorite groups and thus gets nailed.
But words are powerful things. Use nice-sounding words like "discretion" and "professional courtesy," and toss out a carrot like "Don't you want to be let off yourself?" and this will succeed in deceiving many... 
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ninja12
Needs a job
Posts: 3310
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posted December 09, 2005 07:00 PM
Say you are criusing the E-way doing the speed limit when you spot a cop a couple cars
back.
Do you think "wow i'm safe now" or "I hope he do fuk with me"?
What do you fear most when you see blue lights , the ticket you may get or the disrespect and rude treatment you get with it?
The best experience i ever had with a cop was passing each other going in different direction with a cement divider between us.
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238mph
Pro
Posts: 1145
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posted December 09, 2005 07:14 PM
Edited By: 238mph on 9 Dec 2005 19:15
I have some friends that are cops.. and we talk alot... and as much as I like them, it's
a known fact that cops cut other cops freebies all the time.
I don't think that's right... the law applies to all. So by doing that, I lose respect for them.
Second, cops feel they are above the law... how many times do you see a cop cruising
along 10, 15, 20mph over the limit??? Yet if I do that, it's a ticket.... Well, if they don't
have to obey the law, why do I???
Then we have the profiling... If you're on a bike, you know you get more heat than Momma
in a minivan..
So all in all, we can't live without law enforcement, but they need a complete overhaul.
And then they wonder why they don't get the respect they deserve. They bring it on
themselves by breaking the rules...
____________
Pilot Powers took me to the grave, and brought me back...
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trenace
Needs a job
Posts: 3056
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posted December 09, 2005 07:52 PM
Edited By: trenace on 9 Dec 2005 19:54
Actually, with the FHP, the ticket. I have never been treated rudely or in any way unprofessionally by FHP.
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CrotchRocket
Moderator
Bracket Racing with Betsy
Posts: 8038
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posted December 09, 2005 07:56 PM
Here we go...It's time to bash the Police!!!...The only people here that will say good things about the Police are the Police
A tough job but someone has to do it...
It's not easy being BLUE !!!
____________
Jason Miller StreetBike Seminars
*****DragRacers do it better, because they dont cut Corners*****
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trenace
Needs a job
Posts: 3056
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posted December 09, 2005 08:00 PM
Hmm, I must not have made the immediately-above post.
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worm~hole
Needs a life
Miles to go before I sleep....
Posts: 10623
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posted December 09, 2005 11:42 PM
Edited By: worm~hole on 9 Dec 2005 23:43
POLICE...we are your friend and your foe...we're your friend foe life  ...c'mon!...we gotta raise the hate to a dangerously silly level....it good being blue when I'm not you... 
____________
“We sleep safe in our beds because rough men
stand ready in the night to visit violence on those
who would do us harm.”
-George Orwell
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worm~hole
Needs a life
Miles to go before I sleep....
Posts: 10623
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posted December 10, 2005 12:01 AM
...5 out of 8 say 'friend'...nice 
____________
“We sleep safe in our beds because rough men
stand ready in the night to visit violence on those
who would do us harm.”
-George Orwell
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worm~hole
Needs a life
Miles to go before I sleep....
Posts: 10623
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posted December 10, 2005 12:03 AM
senior fishantlers..please bring up my favorite poster, por favor...
____________
“We sleep safe in our beds because rough men
stand ready in the night to visit violence on those
who would do us harm.”
-George Orwell
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted December 10, 2005 12:40 AM
if you have a hard time deciding on whether police are friend or foe, consider what your town would be like without 'em...
I was bagged for evading when i was 18 and the guy went ballistic on me, FUKKER, but
the older i get, the more i appreciate cops.
____________
This moderator uses moderation in moderation
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worm~hole
Needs a life
Miles to go before I sleep....
Posts: 10623
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posted December 10, 2005 04:57 AM
Edited By: worm~hole on 10 Dec 2005 10:25
...ok...that's it...no more mr. nice-cop...tickets for everyone, and I mean everyone...extra bail enhancements for bikeland members who are up to no good...just ensure that you are wearing something from the bikeland store so that I'll know who you are....and please, don't ask me for some broke-dick favors to get you out of the ticket...and if you run, I'll chase you till you crash (as they always seem to do )...if you resist the arrest, I will beat you down to within a nano-inch of your punkass life and not leave a mark (I watch "The Shield" for training in the proper methods)...the cops from "Reno 911" are my favorite heroes next to "Hogan's Heroes" or a hero sandwich (cops love to eat....its a stress thing)...I will kick your ass and you will enjoy it...it will hurt you more than it will hurt me, I triple pinky promise...senior fishantlers, my favorite ball-bustin poster, por favor PLEASE!!!....
____________
“We sleep safe in our beds because rough men
stand ready in the night to visit violence on those
who would do us harm.”
-George Orwell
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Y2KZX12R
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CompetitionCNC.com
Posts: 3762
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posted December 10, 2005 05:20 AM
Edited By: Y2KZX12R on 10 Dec 2005 21:19
Its funny. I live in a small, small, and i mean small town. We never had a cop here in our town untill just a few years ago. We now have a full time cop and a real cop car. Before that we just had a few resident state troopers who lived here and patrolled the entire litchfield county. We have one traffic light and its just a 4 way flashing red. So my town wasnt much different before we had "barney" on the payrole. In this town, if your a criminal, you need to be more worried about the farmers and regular citizens. Most trucks around here have gun racks in the back window and chances are there carrying. The crime here is as close to zero as you can get. We had a burglery here last year in town and the fucker never make it home that day. Never even made it off the womans property.
I ride quite often with the local state troopers here in town. And they are just like you and me. They keep up with thier rice rockets when the pace heats up just like anyone else. Infact I'm going to do a bigbore kit on officer (so and so's) Zrex so he can keep up a little better next year. (isnt that right sonic?) There starting to scramble like rats around here with the rumors of me going to 1375cc for next season. This autta be good next year. A zx14, a pumped up Zrex, a pumped up 10r, and a 1375 12r. So we'll see if the cops are going to be somthing to be afraid of. I think not. So you see, I have to vote "yes".
I'm glad to see them in my rear view mirror.
____________
Y2KZX12R
CompetitionCNC.com
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slug
Pro
Out in search of my mind...
Posts: 1433
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posted December 10, 2005 06:09 AM
yeh usually that "what did i do?" feeling is answered when i look down at the speedo
As long as the officers don't make any active attempts to remove from the citizens their constitutionally GUARANTEED (not given, but guaranteed) rights i got no beef with them at all.
And an officer stopping to help on the side of the road is a rare but welcome experience.
  
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238mph
Pro
Posts: 1145
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posted December 10, 2005 06:39 AM
quote:
Here we go...It's time to bash the Police!!!...The only people here that will say good things about the Police are the Police
A tough job but someone has to do it...
It's not easy being BLUE !!!
Cops and doctors are a lot alike... in that they need to maintain a high peer pressure on their members. I worked with doctors for 20 years... THEY KNOW which of their members
are HACKS, yet they do little to weed them out. Cops are the same... you cops on here
KNOW some guy on the force that has NO BUSINESS being on there... He might tell
racial jokes, might come down real hard on a certain group, etc... you know who they are...
yet what do you do about it???
And don't cry union protection... a simple talk with that guy by 4-5 good members could
turn him around....
If the good cops ratted out the bad ones, and got them out of there... pride would come
up, and so would public respect. Some times even cops have to look in the mirror and
take responsibility for their actions.
I'm not bashing them as a whole... but a few bad ones can bring down the whole damn
force.. just like the cops in New Orleans shoplifting... it set the force back 30 years.
For the record, I've come to aid of a cop that was getting his ass kicked twice... and it's
a scary thing to jump in to help him when there's a big group to go against. So even
though I bitch about the bad ones, I fully support cops in general.
But you cops on here need to be able to talk about the situation, without always pounding
your chest and trying to make it look like your group is perfect... I fully remember that
while I was cuffed and getting the shit kicked out of me I was yelling that my ROOMATE
was this officers's PARTNER!!!
____________
Pilot Powers took me to the grave, and brought me back...
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CrotchRocket
Moderator
Bracket Racing with Betsy
Posts: 8038
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posted December 10, 2005 07:06 AM
238, you seem like you have a bit of inside experience with this police stuff ???
The only thing I will say about you thinking that we dont police our own is nonsence!!!...The job has a way to make sure we do the right thing!!!...It's just that there are always 1 or 2 out of the whole dept. that are rebels and those end up complying...
Not pounding my chest, its just that nobody cares when we do tell it like it is!!!...It will be used against us...
If you were a cop then you would understand and not press the issue!!!
____________
Jason Miller StreetBike Seminars
*****DragRacers do it better, because they dont cut Corners*****
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worm~hole
Needs a life
Miles to go before I sleep....
Posts: 10623
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posted December 10, 2005 10:50 AM
Edited By: worm~hole on 10 Dec 2005 10:52
....right on, CR...I've often said it: we're human, we're not perfect, we're hand-picked from our own societies (we just hope that the selectors are choosing the best and right selectee), one has to be intimate with the job to know what we're talking about, there are checks and balances associated with the job to keep things more on an even keel even when citizens don't believe it or see it, the bad cops eventually get caught and are dealt with appropriately...
....in matters of opinion regarding copwork, the 'advantage' and 'insight' that cops have over non-cops is that we're citizens just like you...we see it from the everyday citizen's point of view as well as any of you....BUT...we also see it from the job's point of view...we really try to balance it...its not chest pounding in as much as it is we know what the hell we're talking about because we're intimate with both sides of our lives...the pissed-off-cuz-he-got-caught rider sees only one thing: cops are his enemy...
...I totally agree....some knuckleheads shouldn't be cops.... it makes our jobs more difficult....it perpetuates the us vs them mentality...bad cops as well as bad citizens are their own worst enemies and have nothing coming from me as far as
i'm concerned...
____________
“We sleep safe in our beds because rough men
stand ready in the night to visit violence on those
who would do us harm.”
-George Orwell
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
Posts: 9660
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posted December 10, 2005 10:56 AM
quote:
I've been written a number of tickets that were for bullshit violations -- violations that in no way represented bad or unsafe driving or riding to anybody -- but were the law, so the fault is the law not the cop.
yes and no. the law itself may be stupid in that case, but the officer has discretion in applying it. if a cop enforces a stupid law he is 100% at fault because he didn't have to write that ticket. i believe such cases are almost laways gonna be revenue collection, harrassment, or because they know or suspect u did somethign else btu cant prove it. imho alot of those silly laws were written just for these reasons.
to the topic at hand tho, i say NO, because cops are not meant to be your friends. they are law enforcement. they are here to protect (i think the "serve" part of the phrase is BS) us, not be our buddies. if i was happy to see a cop i didnt call, then they would have lost half their power. i dont' believe i've had a single experience with an on-duty cop that i wouldnt rather have skipped. after all, even if a cop is 100% polite and correct and is just checking if you are drunk at a roadblock, it is an inconvenience if nother else. if i ever get in a sticky situation where a cop helps me out or even saves my ass, i'll surely change my tune, but that hasnt happened yet and i hope it never will.
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worm~hole
Needs a life
Miles to go before I sleep....
Posts: 10623
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posted December 10, 2005 11:20 AM
...there's no 'cop's fault' when it comes writing tickets, only the 'law's reason' and the 'motorist's responsibility' for his actions....its all an automatic chain of events....and sometimes discretion
____________
“We sleep safe in our beds because rough men
stand ready in the night to visit violence on those
who would do us harm.”
-George Orwell
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worm~hole
Needs a life
Miles to go before I sleep....
Posts: 10623
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posted December 10, 2005 11:21 AM
...uh oh...6 to 7...I'm feeling all tingly inside
____________
“We sleep safe in our beds because rough men
stand ready in the night to visit violence on those
who would do us harm.”
-George Orwell
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ninja12
Needs a job
Posts: 3310
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posted December 10, 2005 02:01 PM
An on duty cops is like a plunger, you don't want it around you unless you need it.
when you need it you are usually in a shity situation. They may or may not help.
Nice guys when off duty , they know they will get the brakes beat off that azz if they get wrong. Can't call your partner for help when your mouth overloads your ass.
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ez2remember82
Novice Class
Posts: 81
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posted December 10, 2005 02:32 PM
this is not my forum but it was up on my computer when i got home after just getting pulled over. Every time i've been pulled over it wasen't for anyting strong enough for a ticket(which knock on wood I have never got on a bike). Most of the time it's just to check me out. Most of the cops here are okay, some are dicks. I had a stereo stollen out of my car once and the cop tried to say that i was the one who did it after explaining that I didn't even have the insurance to cover the stereo, but that's besides the point. Hell I even know a couple, not enough to call friends but enough to know what they were before being cops. It's the ones who forget that they are people just like the rest of us and what they are doing is a job. My wife's mother is the bail bonds agent here in town and she was able to prove that one of the officers was trying to set her up so she would get her bonding license pulled so that the cops wife could do bonds and make more money, but the department decided to do nothing with the officer, how bullshit is that. Cops are such a love/hate thing. Just like people have said there are always one or two bad ones that bring the rest of them down, but that's the way it is. If the dept or other officers know about it get rid of the fuck@rs. They are replaceable just like everyone else, let someone else prove that they can be a good cop. If a boss knew one of his workers was messn' up would they keep them around, no. Everyone has there own opinions and stories to tell. Mine is is that in general they don't bother me of all the hiway patrol, court officers, cops, sherrifs, DOT officers( I drive a truck for a living), the ones that bother me the most are cops.
____________
live life
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worm~hole
Needs a life
Miles to go before I sleep....
Posts: 10623
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posted December 10, 2005 03:08 PM
...I love/hate when that happens...
____________
“We sleep safe in our beds because rough men
stand ready in the night to visit violence on those
who would do us harm.”
-George Orwell
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