TedG
Moderator
Posts: 8222
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posted March 04, 2002 01:06 PM
 Edited By: TedG on 4 Mar 2002 13:13
quote:
If you are going 45 in a 35, what gives a cop the right to do 90-100 mph to catch you? I ask you, which is more dangerous?
Rocket
No shit!!!! I was going south on 395 and they had narrowed the road from 4 lanes to 3 to allow for nighttime construction. So at 7:40ish AM I am driving to work and doing 55ish in the posted 50 zone (on my bike no less...hey I don't want a double fine ticket), some lady goes by at maybe 65(normally posted speed limit) so what do I see next? A sheriff in an SUV doing minimum 90 weaving in and out of traffic to catch her. Tell me that is safe, I called his commander and told him about the soon to be eunuch and the crap I got was that he was trained in driving like that. Give me a break and go pound sand up your ass, that is bullshit.
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
  
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22348bCVC
Zone Head
Posts: 798
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posted March 04, 2002 01:10 PM
Edited By: 22348bCVC on 4 Mar 2002 13:29
...hmmmm...seems to me like the 'RESPONSIBILTY' theme is prevelant in the replies...we all want to be responsible and accountanle (well, most of us) but everyone has a subjective view of what RESPONSIBILITY is and how its actually practiced...as the saying goes, unless you are intimate with why laws are made, how laws are made, and how laws are enforced, I imagine it to be very frustrating for some of you, me included!
...just remember, we in the h-perf business or who have inclinations towards things hi-perf and driving/riding hi-perf machinery are in the minority...and majority rules, doesn't it?
Let me ask the people who think speeding laws (for instance) suck...if you were in charge of enforcement, how would you set up the system? How do you address the peoples' concerns of whom you are sworn to 'protect and serve'? No, not the 'school zone' laws, but the everyday business park, residential, county roads issues. And what if, say, on one of your 'no-limits' roads two motorist of (gasp!) two motorcyclist cross over the line and head-on at 100mph+?...and one of the mass-of-goo on the road was someone you knew?...and what if it happened at least twice a month?...and what if the 'runner' or the pursuing cops killed innocents on the road because of the pursuit?...what do you do?
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...just relax...my dog wants to use only one of your legs...
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TedG
Moderator
Posts: 8222
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posted March 04, 2002 01:22 PM
Edited By: TedG on 4 Mar 2002 13:39
Come on lets not be stupid, but there used to be a safe and sane rule here in Nevada and it worked until the Republicans came up with the 55 MPH rule. Weaving in and out of traffic is endangering people, but doing 75 on a 4 lane with nothing but clear road ahead isn't.
223, tell me you don't speed and don't get out of tickets a "civilian" wouldn't, then and only then will you get no arguement from me. Until then some of your arguments don't hold water very well.  Now remember Dudly you are an officer of the law and sworn to be honest and loyal, especially to Nell, so we expect you to tell the truth.
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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22348bCVC
Zone Head
Posts: 798
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posted March 04, 2002 01:39 PM
Edited By: 22348bCVC on 4 Mar 2002 13:41
I go slow therefore I am
Ted...c'mon, buddy...I ride a 12R ferchissakes! nuff' said...I have gotten out of tickets as well as I have given many warnings...or I should say that I have given more warnings than I have been stopped... but I don't get stopped as much some because I use my head when I ride...AND I NEVER RUN, for obvious reasons...besides, do you think the on-duty cop knows who I am when I'm on the bike and wearing my full-face helmet
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...just relax...my dog wants to use only one of your legs...
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TedG
Moderator
Posts: 8222
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posted March 04, 2002 01:44 PM
223, You told the truth (we be proud), but like I say they may stop you but your ticket to warning ratio is far different than mine would be. Even with all the humiliating sucking up I have to do. It is damn hard to to show respect to an armed meter molly.
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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22348bCVC
Zone Head
Posts: 798
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posted March 04, 2002 01:51 PM
You can ride in the city I work anytime, Ted
...and nuthin' but the truth so help me 12R...c'ya!...gotta suit up, load up, and see what comes up next...be safe, ride safe... 
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...just relax...my dog wants to use only one of your legs...
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hott-rodd
Novice Class
Posts: 96
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posted March 04, 2002 02:26 PM
223, Just a few quick question?
Why cops think the public is so stupid. Please Explain..
1. What "I'm just doing my job " means, when everybody knows you would let YOUR friends and other cops go.
2. How you can be one of the good guys, when you witness your partner just kicked the dog out of the down and injured perp. and you do nothing.
3. Why it's ok and legal for a Officer to physically abuse a driver over a speeding ticket. (stop at gun point, pulled out the car, forced to lie face down and cuffed in the street)
4. If it's the rookies and asshole doing all this bad stuff, why don't you good guys clean your own house.
5. Why do cops get suspended WITH PAY for shooting a civilian, and a civilian get life in prison if he don't fall on a shot gun, or blow his own brain out,
for shooting an officer(even a over the top asshole).
6. Why are many cops so pissed off when they pull you over for traffic violation.
7. what's next , if you speed and don't turn yourself in
you loss the house.
Please don't get me wrong, ever stop has not been a nightmare, but ever time the lights come on, i'm more than
a little nervous. I would like to believe that i am going to be treated fairly and with respect, and justice will be decided in court, but this is not always the case.
ASK RODNEY KING.
I don't and will not stop in a dark or unpopulated area,
I've had my experience with that and lived to know better.
If they start taking property for failure to stop. I will be force to run. I rather risk the bike that my life.
Nothing personal, but you asked.
Let's try to keep this clean and RESPECTFUL.
I know it's a tough job, i just don't like the way some do it. and the fact others do it on a selectively.
PROTECT AND SERVE ME!
the little guy. p.s...i can't spell for shit
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TedG
Moderator
Posts: 8222
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posted March 04, 2002 03:07 PM
Here is how I would like it to work, double my fine (good for revenue) but let me skate on points (as long as I'm not endangering anyone within reason) and I will be the happy camper, broker but happier. Hey, this thing where they base your insurance rates on your credit is for me!!!!
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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22348bCVC
Zone Head
Posts: 798
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posted March 04, 2002 03:15 PM
hott-rodd...you make some valid, some emotional, and some remarks based on being uninformed...I've walked in citizen's shoes, I'm walking in a cops shoes...I think I'm somewhat qualified to see both sides. I'll answer your Qs as best as I can chronologically.
1)we think some people are stupid because, well, they are...you don't have to be a cop to assess that.
2)we let perfect strangers go, too.
3)unprofessional conduct does get reported and investigated. many careers terminate because of it.
4)there are policies in place for all departments as to when and where the gun is presented in most all situations, why we prone people out face down, why we cuff. DO YOU ANYTHING ABOUT THE DRIVER'S HISTORY AND ACTUALLY KNOW WHY THE DRIVER WAS BEING STOPPED? we live in a dangerous world with many bad people who would just as soon kill you for $5 (for instance)...and if you don't believe that, watch the news and read the stats.
5)we clean house more often than you think. it just doesn't make the front page.
6)all shootings are a serious matter. all get investigated thoroughly. most shootings are righteous. some are very bad. cops lose their jobs. some go to jail. just like anybody else. then they face an even more perilous life behind bars. you can only imagine what happens to a cop in behind bars if he's not careful. hideous.
7)some cops have 'bad days'...just like you. then they have to face the music and have his day turn even worse because of a citizen's complaint for 'unprofessional behavior'
8)uh, no...that'll never happen
RODNEY KING WAS WRONG...the majority of public didn't see ALL of the video (no thanks to the $$$$$ grubbin' media who wanted a sensational story...and you'll never, ever convince me otherwise so don't even try)
when you're signaled to stop, stop when it is REASONABLY SAFE TO DO SO AND IN A WELL LIT AREA IF AVAILABLE...not at your house ten miles away.
I hope I've answered or enlightened you somewhat. Its not an easy job, not for everybody. and its not like the movies or made-for-TV shows. It serious stuff.
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...just relax...my dog wants to use only one of your legs...
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mo
Expert Class
Posts: 128
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posted March 04, 2002 06:22 PM
Who on this board dont know where crack central is in there town? where the fuck do cops find time to write tickets?find some real criminals to catch. you certainly dont need to dreate more. and when every body stops running who the fuck they gonna chase?I hope there cruiser can hit 199mph!whooowhee If you havent pulled a fast one on your local law enforcement your lyin or need to trade your 12 fer a scooter PS. 2yr TDC for bullshit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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KW
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22348bCVC
Zone Head
Posts: 798
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posted March 04, 2002 07:06 PM
Edited By: 22348bCVC on 4 Mar 2002 22:59
quote:
Who on this board dont know where crack central is in there town? where the fuck do cops find time to write tickets?find some real criminals to catch. you certainly dont need to dreate more. and when every body stops running who the fuck they gonna chase?I hope there cruiser can hit 199mph!whooowhee If you havent pulled a fast one on your local law enforcement your lyin or need to trade your 12 fer a scooter PS. 2yr TDC for bullshit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
wow, mo...I can see why you're angry and why you would post the way you do...again, to be fair...a little information here...patrol work is usually divided amongst the troops in the department...there's the traffic division (they mainly do traffic and anything that has to do with traffic, vehicles, and the road), there's the patrol division (they do everything from Public Relations to picking up parolees), there's the Special Enforcement Detail (or SWAT/K9/Bomb-Arson/etc.), there's the School Resource unit (imagine that...cops on campus...its a reflection of how violent society has become), there are the detectives (who continue the investigation that the patrol initially got dispatched to because the patrol unit has to answer the flow of calls coming in), there's the Domestic Violence unit, the Child Abuse unit, the Elder Abuse unit, Fraud, Drugs, etc., etc., etc...and I could go on, but you get the idea. But mainly you'll come into contact with the patrol unit or the traffic unit. 'WE' are out there 'catching the real criminals', its just that you don't know what's going on behind the scenes, so to speak. You'd be pleased to know that patrol officers (now remember what their primary task is) sometimes catch bad guys everyday from 'simple' traffic stops...and sometimes its just a ticket or a warning for regular john/jane doe who commited a moving violation of some sort. 'WE' know where the crackhouses are, but another unit is handling it or working on it...but right now we're here on the side of the road because you were caught doing something illegal.
yeah, mo...I hear you...but the cops don't 'create more'...if you don't 'do' anything, we don't 'do' anything...if anything, we've become a reactionary force to what some violent and habitual people continue do to in our society...it seems we can hardly keep up...so our government inserts laws to help stem the terrible tide...society's not perfect...cops and our jobs aren't perfect...but we all, as part of our 'communities', try our very best...its not easy at all...and all this because we debate on whether we should run from the cops or not, on whether its the right or wrong thing to do...this is good discussion and I hope I have shed some fair light to the matter...well at least from this officer's point of view...
...AND HELL NO I'M NOT SELLING MY BIKE YA' GOOF! I'M GETTING ANOTHER ONE AS SOON AS I CAN!
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...just relax...my dog wants to use only one of your legs...
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redelk
Moderator
Please... speak to the hand.
Posts: 3212
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posted March 04, 2002 07:25 PM
Sooooo.....
The way I see it, it goes something like this...
There are good mechanics and there are bad mechanics.
There are good doctors and there are bad doctors.
There are good riders and there are bad riders.
There are good lawyers and there are bad lawyers.
There are good bike dealers and there are bad bike dealers.
There are even good friends and there are bad friends.
So, one could logically assume that...
There are good cops and there are bad cops.
Working closely with those in law enforcement for over a quarter of a century, I can easily testify that there are both good and bad cops. I also know that even good cops can have a bad day and on rare ocassions, a bad cop will have a good day. Another thing I have learned is that there is something that both good and bad people, no matter what their profession is, have in common. They are all human.
Some folks seem to almost always be dickweeds and some seem like they'd give their worst enemy the shirt of their back. I will never try to figure out why. You see, there are many out there that believe I'm the nicest person in the world. There is an equal amount (if not more) that firmly believe I'm the biggest dickweed in the world.
I don't believe that I have treated either group differently, but if one was to ask them (from either group), you'd find radically different views about me. Since I don't believe I have as many personalities as "Sybil" (last time I checked), I equally don't have a clue on why they believe the way they do.
So how does this apply to cops? Well, I've been REAL LUCKY! I've been pulled over approximatly 28 times in the past 5 years. On 3 ocassions, I actually got a ticket, yet right now, I have a "clean" driving record. My "probation" on all 3 tickets have long since expired.
To give an example of "good cop/bad cop", a few years back, I got pulled over by a state trooper and he was getting ready to write me a ticket. When he called my license in, another trooper heard it and recognized that it was me. He was near by and he "rushed" to the scene. After the second trooper arrived, he had a brief "private conversation" with the first trooper.
It turned out the the second trooper needed me to do some decals for him. I got off with a warning. I can only guess, but I figure that I was doing abot 30 mph over. My "excuse" would have been that the flow of traffic arround me was doing at least 15 over (and they always do... that's why the troopers always hang out all that stretch of highway).
Still, it boils down to the fact that no matter what everybody else was doing, I was still violating the law and my guilt would have warranted the ticket.
Now a year goes by. I would see that trooper almost every weekend while heading out to my favorite twisties. Out of respect to all law enfocement, when we would pass each other, I'd wave at him. Just like I do with ALL cops. Well, it seems that he'd had about enough. He pulls me over... again.
This time, my trooper friend is around to bail me out. 59 in a 45. Here's the "trick" to this story. The trooper was well aware that I had a ticket on my record in my home town. There would be no way I could get probation on this ticket, because of it. With him knowing this as well, he had the oppertunity to FUCK ME BIG TIME for another THREE YEARS!
Instead of assigning the ticket to a court in my home town (and the town where the violation occured), he chose to assign it to the town across the river. About 15 miles from where we were sitting. The results? Six months probation and it didn't go onto my record. He didn't have to do that. The point is, he did. So, everytime I go down that stretch of highway, guess what? I rarely speed. I guess he acomplished what he wanted.
I have a sheriff in one county that has given me a "Carte Blanc" to do what ever the hell I want to in his county. That is, just as long as I don't endanger tne rest of the motoring public. I also have a sheriff in another county who says that if I get caught speeding in his county again, he'll throw me under the jail and take my bike.
I've have seen where a "good" cop had a "bad day" and would give his own wife a ticket. The fact that he had just finished zipping the body bag up on a 6 year old girl, might have had something to do with it.
In all the times I have been pulled over, I've always realized one thing and assumed one thing. The thing I realize is that I am GUILTY for violating the traffic laws. The thing that I assume is that the cop just zipped up some body bag in a needless and pointless death.
Fortunatly, I have yet to have been pulled over by the "bag" cop and the results, after properly pulling over and showing the proper respect (as well as my concealed weapon permit and informing them the "status" of my weapon), has been numerous warnings. Some for speeds well in excess of 100 mph. Lucky? You BET! I can't help but believe that leaving my "attitude" in my helmet when I took it off, had something to do with that "luck".
Now, I've also been "screwed" by a motorcycle cop that chose to "pile on" the violations, too. Five violations with three of them being bogus. He and I both knew that they were bogus. Still, my "issue" wasn't with him. That's what the courts are for. I had the 3 bogus violations dropped in a "negotiated plea" of guilty on the other two counts. Which I was actually guilty of.
Have I run for the cops? "Kinda". In reality, I don't think he even turned around. He just flashed his "blues" at me and kept on going. I slowed back down less then a mile down the highway. If he had wanted to catch me, he would have.
As far as police chases go, please refer back to the start of my post. Yes, I acknowledge that some result in tragic loss of innocent lives. Yes, I acknowledge that some are senseless and unnecessary. I also acknowledge that some result in the capture of individuals, that even though it all started over a "simple traffic violation", they were wanted for a varity of other crimes.
Should "pursuit policies" be evaluated? You DAMN SKIPPY! EVERY LAST ONE OF THEM! Sadly, in these "reviews", we run the risk of ending up with something that "penalizes" the average citizen, while attempting to catch and punish the "real criminals". While the victims of the "old policies" scream for "justice", isn't it foolish to think that the results wouldn't be something like this?
Isn't this the same mindset that brought us "Zero Tolorence" concerning weapons and drugs in our public schools (i.e. pocket knives and asprin)? Isn't this the same mindset that has brought us all the attacks on our Second Amendment rights?
My father has a saying about such thinking. "Either your part of the problem or your part of the solution... which is it?".
I just put the finishing touches on a 8 page letter to a State Representitive that claimed, in a local newspaper article, that motorcyclists and their injuries are a burden on the state taxpayers. Since he and I are "aquaintences", I have some hope that he'll actually read it. The fact that we'll be at the same high school reunion for three days this summer, doesn't hurt my "cause" either.
All the same, in this case, I've chose to attempt to be part of the "solution". Like my father would ask... which are you?
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There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games.
-Ernest Hemingway
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TedG
Moderator
Posts: 8222
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posted March 04, 2002 08:09 PM
As for good cops and bad cops...we are only human, but Highway Patrols are nothing but armed meter mollies here. Those assholes couldn't catch a real crimanal if the fucker turned himself in. They would try to figure out how to give him a ticket and go back to eating donuts. They seldom give anyone a break and never a motorcycle, at least not that I have heard. Worthless pieces of shit. The goddamn road is full of people following too close, agressive drivers, almost no one here signals, trucks with loads falling out, and those soon to be eunuchs are staring at their radar guns and swaggering around like they are gods. Bozopusswads.
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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frEEk
Administrator
ummm... yeah
Posts: 9660
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posted March 04, 2002 08:27 PM
damn it redelk. stop composing such good posts. no-one can follow an act like that
i think theres only one point i want to make that hasnt be covered already, and thats regarding the existence and exact letter of many traffic laws, in particular ones like speeding which annoy us so much. very often, they are WAY too low. i have got my share of tickets for speeding when there was really no reason to give a ticket, ie i was notviolating the spirit of the law. and thats where my beef stands. i happen to believe very strongly in the spirit of the law, which is to say the reasons behind individual laws. they r always reasonable, realistic, and just. but the spirit is often/usually (in my experience) not followed, the letter of the law is. problem is, how the hell do u enforce the spirit of the law?
writing a law that just says "you must drive at a speed that is safe for the road" would be great, cause i dont think i would ever have greceived a ticket in my life, and it would mean fines for slowpokes that drive so slow it is unsafe, or at least frustrating. but how r u gonna enforce that? every ticket would be contested and a court case several hours or longer would ensue. u gotta choose an empirical [sp] limit (one that can be measured). its hard to argue "he/she was driving too fast given the circumstances", but it's easy to say "he/she was going over 55mph".
ok, so now we know we have to choose an empirical speed system. where do we set the limits? most of us would say they'r too low. but since u can only have one limit, and not a chart with limits for diferent levels of congestion, different weather, different vehicles. only thing u can really do is set the limit to the speed that is safe for most vehicles most of the time. obviously speeds are not set for an RV on snow, then we'd be going 5mph everywhere. also, u have to set the speed for the 99th percentile worst driver (worst 1% of drivers). u cant set the limit to what is safe for Michael Shumacher driving a van in the rian. he'd prolly still outrun half of us on our 12Rs, while making eggs benny in the back. so to summarize, the speed limit has to be set for a below average driver, driving a below average vehicle, in below average conditions. and of course there are plenty of variables i'm not even touching.
now dont get me wrong. i'm the first to argue speed limits and every ticket i'v ever got. i think they are all bs. i DID break the law in all cases, but only the letter of the law, not the spirit. unfortunately, knowing all the difficulties of setting and enforcing the spirit of the law just doesnt help. i still get really pissed. especially when i see people driving withing the letter of the law, but being complete unsafe idiots. they very, very rarely get busted IMHO, but r dangerous, and even more so, frustrating as all hell. hell, i would say the 50kph (30mph) speed limit in most downtowns is definitely too high, even for a good new car & an above average driver (which we all believe we are of course). i tend to go below the limit downtown in any vehicle i drive, unless it is damn near deserted. even then, the chance of someone jsut runnin onto the road or shootin out an alley is enough to keep me about the speed limit.
i could go on forever, & i have w family & frinds many times. teh conversations i have had in my head on this topic alone would make the encyclopedia britanica [sp?] looks like a 10 year old's essay. and it has gone around & around in circles so many times a figure skater would get dizzy.
i certainly havent thought of an answer yet, & i dont believe i ever will. if all drivers on the road were excellent drivers, we could definitely remove all limits & traffic laws, cause people would jsut use uncommon sense & experience to set their own laws. it would be WONDERFUL. i'd like to see people go thru so much driver training and testing that we would be FORCED to become F1 driver candidates. which of course would mean 80% of the population (ok, so i made that number up) would never get a license. i believe many people jsut dont have what it takes to be a really good driver, no matter how much training they got. what do we do with them? an orwellian [sp] vision if ever there was one. here they just switched to graduated licensing a few years back, and its a step in the right direction, but it's hardly an answer. really, its almost a joke. so people have to drive around with a big N on their car for 2 years? i doubt that has reduced accidents significantly. its just easier to prosecute new drivers who broke the law.
well, thats enough out of me. i just got home from a day of driving cars around town delivering parts, and now i have a 1.5 hour drive to whistler ahead of me. yes i drive alot. fortunately, i enjoy driving. yes i consider myself an above average driver (not rider tho). as a last thought, (and this has occured to me alot lately), for every stupid move u see in traffic & say "fuckin moron", havent u made the same or a similar stupid move many times before? i know i have.
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mo
Expert Class
Posts: 128
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posted March 04, 2002 08:30 PM
well there seems to be plenty of opinions to run or not to run but you can bet your bike if its in effect here it will be every where soon. lets get the to ground rules. as to when the pursuit begins when the lights are on?or as soon as the ocifer decides to chase? say vehicle A is east bound at a rate of 55mph and vehicle ZX is traveling west at a blistering 150. A decides he will pursue ZX but ZX knows A is not only coming but a idiot for doing so. ZX has not seen nor heard As attemt to stop ZX if for some unknown reason A catches up to ZX {like when pigs can fly}{no really} ZX stops. what then? and I know a few decent cops so there are at least 2 out there. and the speed limit should be indivisulised as to skill. or at least for bikes a truck has a posted rate slower then the rest do to its size and inability to stop within a certain distance givin a bikes ability to stop reasonly faster then a car a bike should have a higher posted limit.
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KW
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TedG
Moderator
Posts: 8222
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posted March 04, 2002 08:48 PM
Actually the speed limits are supposed to be decided by engineers. They are supposed to look at the road and determine the max speed it can handle. One thing here is that if you are in a rural area and it is daylight and you are only 10 miles over the limit(between 45 and 65 and not over 70) the law says that you get a courtesy ticket with a $25 fine and no points.
Back to the point, I would never run in a congested area but if it was a lonely road especally here in Nevada, if the cop is going the other way and I see him wanting to flip around all he will see is a vapor trail because I am gone.
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Ted
2000 Green ZX12 sold
The fast color!!
Green 2005 ZX10R
2009 Concours Black ABS
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22348bCVC
Zone Head
Posts: 798
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posted March 05, 2002 12:22 AM
Edited By: 22348bCVC on 5 Mar 2002 01:47
mo/hott-rodd...the pursuit starts the moment the officer reasonably determines that the citizen is not going to comply with the stop...it could be as far as 1/4 mile after light-up...it could be shorter than that...there needs to be common sense and/or other circumstances involved and most cops know what they are. more and more pursuits are terminated by the primary officer, the supervisor, or the comm. center than you may realize, but once again, its not front page news. ALOT of citizen's opinions of law enforcement are formulated by what the media wants to show you...as they say, "bad news sells"...never mind the good that goes unseen.
a cop's job is not to punish. cops who summarily punish should not be cops in the first place. the courts dole out punishment. but if a subject physically resists an officer who is trying to gain compliance during the arrest/apprehension, and if the subject tries to hurt the officer, the fight's on...and it will no doubt feel like punishment for BOTH sides...and BOTH sides will no doubt get hurt
...and sometimes people are hurt a little bit, hurt seriously, or crippled for life...or they die trying...like an old saying I once heard, "When two tigers fight...one will be seriously hurt...the other will surely die." Try not to fight and live in peace as best as you can.
I love my job as I'm sure most cops do...most of us don't want to hurt people, but we will hurt those who hurt us or innocent others...just as you would if your life depended on it...and we don't want to die inspite of the job's inherent dangers. We see more shitty, disgusting, and horrific stuff in our short or long careers than most people (who are not in emergency services) will ever see in their lifetime. We want to go home at the end of every shift in one piece (in mind and body) and cook ourselves a meal, putz around the house, play with our dogs, hang out with our family and friends, tuck in our kids, and ride our bikes. And the next day we do it all over again and hope we get to go home again. Hey, we're only human...with a different kind of job that most wouldn't want to do. But 'we' chose to do it for our own personal, and hopefully, good and honorable reasons....
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...just relax...my dog wants to use only one of your legs...
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EastBayDave
Needs a job
Posts: 2245
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posted March 05, 2002 05:34 AM
I still haven't got a serious answer yet. What would YOU officer do to a rider caught at say 110+mph over the limit?
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Enjoy the ride!
02' ZRX1200
00' ZX12R sold
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pat830
Expert Class
Posts: 135
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posted March 05, 2002 06:17 AM
Whew, serious thread.
It's all about the money.
Money to municipalities via fines and court costs.
Money to insurance companies via higher risk factors for the person with the violations which translates to higher premiums.
Money, Money, Money.........
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ezx11
Novice Class
Posts: 35
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posted March 05, 2002 08:01 AM
quote:
It's all about the money.
Money to municipalities via fines and court costs.
Money to insurance companies via higher risk factors for the person with the violations which translates to higher premiums.
Money, Money, Money.........
sad but true, thats why i dont stop
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Great Minds think of Great Things
petty minds think of petty things
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Otis
Needs a job
Captain Kickstand
Posts: 3028
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posted March 05, 2002 08:55 AM
Edited By: Otis on 5 Mar 2002 09:00
Man lots of opinions and attitudes on this thread. I have a record that is embarrasssing to say the least, to give you an example, the last court date I had the judge had to stand up to show me my record, it's like 9-10 pages long having accumulated over 75 points in my 18 years of driving then with all the times I got our of the points going to court I have been pulled over a great deal. I've only run twice, MANY YEARS AGO while in southern Ohio on lonely roads, was not caught. In the last three years while I have accumulated an addition 8 points, I have also been let go by an officer 7 times, yes 7 times pulled over and let go with a warning. Why you ask? Because the second, and I mean the second I saw the lights I pulled over, except for one time I drove an addition 1/2 mile to be able to get off the road, told the cop I was sorry I didn't pull over sooner but I didn't want him to be standing so closet to traffic, he let me go in less than 30 seconds. Two officers actaully thanked me for not running, not because they wouldn't be able to catch me but because they didn't want to see me splat myself trying to get away (one even made a joke about spike strips and motorcycles not going well together, I knew he was kidding and we both laughed at that).
What's my point, none really except I can say I have been pulled over many many many many times in my life and of all those times I can honestly say that only twice did I think that the officer was really an asshole to me, and I deserved it as both of them were waaaayyyyyyyyy over the speed limit and I'm sure I was acting like an ass to him.
I know guys who run, shit I saw it at the Gap last Sept, riding with 3 other fellas and when the cop came 2 of em' were GONE! I was last in line and saw the cop come right behind me and what happened? I immediately thought of my wife and pulled right over, he went by me of course and ofter the other fellas, they got away.
If you want to run, fine it's you're life, but all I have to say and it don't mean much to most is do yourself and your loved ones a favor, DON'T run, it's just not worth it. And if you say it is, you must not have a whole lot to live for.
I like what CVC has to say here, he's been nothing but cordial in the face of criticism and really seems to just want to make you think about the facts, not the emotions.
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It's a free country brother
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harryzx-12
Needs a job
Posts: 3643
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posted March 05, 2002 09:33 AM
I stopped last time I got caught speeding
It was a florida highway patrol.My dad called them peckerheads when I was young.Dad was right.The city and county cops are pretty cool for the most part.I thought of running from the FHP but was on my way to work and decieded not to.Where I was at There is no way that fucker would have caught me.I was about 1/2 mile from a very twisty road that I have been riding since I was a teenager it leads to another road that I go to do top speed runs on.My dad lives out in the forest where this road is.Motorola is the only one that had a chance.
I have been told by the guy in the control tower the a sheriff chased me (I never saw him) My mother in law just retired from the dispatch from the sheriffs dept and apperantly I went screaming by a offduty sheriff on his bike and he was telling my mother-in-law about and said "If I ever catch that son of a bitch he's going to jail" She asked him to describe the bike and she started laughing. He asked what she was laughing about and she told him "you're never gonna catch him" .He then asked , why do you know who he is? And she said yes , it's my son-in-law!
I would pull over in an area that I don't know unless I'd be going to jail anyway.
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"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways- Body thoroughly used up, totally worn out...Screaming "WOO HOO, What a Ride !!!"
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Bigju
Expert Class
Posts: 238
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posted March 05, 2002 10:07 AM
I haven't been posting much lately, but Rocket you brought this one out! When was the last time you saw a woman and her baby killed because of some dickhead that didn't want a ticket or was on a stolen bike? When was the last time your car was totaled by a person running from the police? How many dead bodies have you picked up this year? It isn't about a police state, its about discouragement of the crime. When a person runs they endanger others, I give a fuck if they kill themselves its innocent people I'm worried about! I'm a Tactical officer if the Homicide capitol of the country working in the highest crime area. So when we get into this police state shit I think your talking out the side of your neck. I worked on my day off to catch a killer that killed 1 person, tried to kill another and had a list of victims. If you hurt or kill another person there is a place for you, its called JAIL. I didn't want a ticket or didn't want to go is some bullshit! If you don't want the ticket don't fucking speed! Real fucking simple!!!!
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ROCKET J
Zone Head
Goes to water over a dummy!!!
Posts: 602
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posted March 05, 2002 10:15 AM
Edited By: ROCKET J on 5 Mar 2002 10:23
Like, bummer, man....
Without sounding like a reject from Woodstock, and using terms like "the System" and "the Man",let me say this: The System is corrupt (mostly) and is in place to make money (mostly). The police, ah what the hell, the Man, even though he is just doing his job, has been to some extent brainwashed and corrupted to the mantra of the System.
One of my favorite things to do (my wife hates this) is to pace police cars. On the highway where everybody cowers like sheep at 10 mph under the speed limit like they are ALL wanted felons, I will go as fast as the cop. If he is just out driving at his leisure (at well over the speed limit) without lights and siren, I'm there. After all, he has the certified speedometer, mine must be off.
Ted, are you talking about the "energy crisis" 55 mph and 68 degree thermostat in your house, when you say the republicans lowered the speed limit? The other side just wants you to not even have a car or bike.
It is interesting that the speed limit used to be higher everywhere, not just on interstates. It is also interesting that when certain states wanted to raise speed limits on interstates the feds balked. when the feds wanted to raise speed limits, some states balked. 70 mph used to be the minimum, and cars were not as agile or had the safety contrivances of today.
Speed by itself, rarely plays a part in highway accidents.
When was the last time you saw someone get a ticket for impeding the flow of traffic? Why aren't truckers who drive in the left lane pulled from their vehicle and shot on the spot? How many times have you seen one or two "law abiders" putting along in their cars, holding up traffic for miles?
Make drivers ed a "real class" that you take at least for a year, and have things like common sense driving, emergency maneuvers and the like included.
Have something in place that justifies (I just LOVE this term) meter mollies. If your department writes x amount of tickets, then you better have so much manpower dedicated to rapes and bank robberies (solving not committing) and they better be bringing badguys to justice, not ticketing taxpaying citizens who are barely making it, and now have to decide between paying the mortgage or a ticket.
CVC, you guys have bad PR. It is self induced. Why hassle your bosses, your employers, the people who you WORK FOR? I am talking about regular citizens. Don't tell me you need a raise either. It is called biting the hand that feeds you. I live in Cincinnati. Everybody has heard about the cops here. The only thing wrong with this city is it is pushed around by thugs (posing as Baptist ministers), well that and the weather. The shootings here were just. The beat cops (probably not the best name) here need to quit being punks toward the general public. A couple of years ago, I was at Kroger looking at the magazines and there were two CPD officers at the magazine rack. First off I had to ask them to move out of the way so I could look at a bike or car book, whatever it was, but the clincher was that they were reading Guns and Ammo. I read Guns and Ammo too. It is a free country. They can read it too. At HOME. One time I was walking and saw a chase end. The one cop asked me if I would stick around and give the supervisor a statement. "Sure" I said, because I wanted to help and I was gawking like everybody else. The cop said just wait here a minute. I was leaning on a Crown Vic waiting, and another cop (young punk type that I spoke about) asked me "is that your car?" Smart ass question, deserves smart ass answer. "I paid for it" I said, half joking. "You're gonna" is what he said. At that moment his badge should of been removed from his chest permanently, and he should of not been allowed to have income for a year, so his wife and kids go hungry as a lesson as to what a piece of shit their husband and dad is. Use some sense. Except in crime families, people have always been brought up to respect and help the police. The fact that they are not liked, is squarely on their shoulders, no one else's.
Rocket
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If I get any smarter, my head will explode!
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Otis
Needs a job
Captain Kickstand
Posts: 3028
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posted March 05, 2002 10:51 AM
Rocket, how old are you? I don't say this to be mean it's just that most of your thoughts sound of that of a rebelious high school kid, not that of a man who has been around awile and lived a bit. Pacing cop cars and "I paid for it" stuff. Kind of childish I'd say.
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It's a free country brother
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