posted August 06, 2005 06:39 PM
Are you on the wait list for the '06? Just wondering... local dealer had a wait list for people for the '06 (hoping for a 14R)...
are you on a list like dat?
____________ What business is it of yours where I'm from, Friendo?
posted August 06, 2005 09:32 PM
Y'all are in luck... what with me FINALLY -- after a couple of years of waiting to be able to do it -- going and getting a lot of parts for the current 12 and doing a fair bit of work on it, that definitely will trigger Kawasaki to promptly release a massively-uprated replacement!
quote:Y'all are in luck... what with me FINALLY -- after a couple of years of waiting to be able to do it -- going and getting a lot of parts for the current 12 and doing a fair bit of work on it, that definitely will trigger Kawasaki to promptly release a massively-uprated replacement!
If its got a 12 month warranty, where do I send the check? :-)
posted August 06, 2005 10:42 PM
Man I tell you they better have something up their sleeve for the street rider.
I live in the midwest and I don't know that matters but even with Kawasaki sitting atop the
liter bike pack with the zx-10 ( I mean you can't pick up a magazine for awhile there without hearing about how great the 10 is, blah blah blah) but Kawasaki seems like an after thought out on the street. Tons of Hondas and R1's and of course the GSXR. And truly the 10 is a beast! Kids should be flogging those up and down Main St. all night long.
But as far as I can see, they ain't. Probably could point the finger at any number of folks at KMC and have it stick. Could proabably point a finger at the Kawa dealers in this area being total dirtbags too. Take this advice from a 35 year old red light to red light poser:
Come with something good. Not just a half step. ZX-14 would be nice move for real.
Make sure it works. And own up to the shit that don't and fix it. Please don't let oil be leaking out of the tail section again. Please.
And while I got yer ear( or eye) could you cut a fella a freeking break on the OEM replacemt parts? $650 bucks for a new radiator? $650 bucks? It's aluminum for chrissakes. Costs about 45 dollars to make that piece I bet and another 50 to ship it here to the midwest.
Don't get me started on the $10 replacement key and that awful battery tray....
Cut me a deal for owning a Kawasaki when I buy a new Kawasaki. Lord knows the trials and tribulations zx-12 owners have endured and most of us are still in love with this bike. Customer loyalty should be rewarded with manufacturer loyalty.
That got a little preachy. Sorry about that. You know they make this stuff called
SPARKS. Orange flavored malt liquor with Ginseng and Guarana and a ton of caffeine in it too. and 6% alchohol. Whoooo Hoooo! Good stuff for sure.
quote:Man I tell you they better have something up their sleeve for the street rider.
I live in the midwest and I don't know that matters but even with Kawasaki sitting atop the
liter bike pack with the zx-10 ( I mean you can't pick up a magazine for awhile there without hearing about how great the 10 is, blah blah blah) but Kawasaki seems like an after thought out on the street. Tons of Hondas and R1's and of course the GSXR. And truly the 10 is a beast! Kids should be flogging those up and down Main St. all night long.
But as far as I can see, they ain't. Probably could point the finger at any number of folks at KMC and have it stick. Could proabably point a finger at the Kawa dealers in this area being total dirtbags too. Take this advice from a 35 year old red light to red light poser:
Come with something good. Not just a half step. ZX-14 would be nice move for real.
Make sure it works. And own up to the shit that don't and fix it. Please don't let oil be leaking out of the tail section again. Please.
And while I got yer ear( or eye) could you cut a fella a freeking break on the OEM replacemt parts? $650 bucks for a new radiator? $650 bucks? It's aluminum for chrissakes. Costs about 45 dollars to make that piece I bet and another 50 to ship it here to the midwest.
Don't get me started on the $10 replacement key and that awful battery tray....
Cut me a deal for owning a Kawasaki when I buy a new Kawasaki. Lord knows the trials and tribulations zx-12 owners have endured and most of us are still in love with this bike. Customer loyalty should be rewarded with manufacturer loyalty.
That got a little preachy. Sorry about that. You know they make this stuff called
SPARKS. Orange flavored malt liquor with Ginseng and Guarana and a ton of caffeine in it too. and 6% alchohol. Whoooo Hoooo! Good stuff for sure.
Maybe that is the list fish is talking about , being first on the service department list for recall work! Or maybe first on the list of the "clutch petition". Kawi doesnt stand behind thier product very well as far as I can tell. It seems to take intervention from others(Doug or EL) to get what should have been fixed fixed!
posted August 07, 2005 06:33 AM
Edited By: 238mph on 7 Aug 2005 07:35
The mere fact that Tren and Blitz are spending a bank roll on their 12's means new
new bigger replacment will come out!!!
posted August 07, 2005 06:39 AM
I saw the 1300 which is the ZX11 up graded to the 1200 and now the 1300 but it is a Sport Tourer more for touring and not speed. so it may be that this engine with some tweaking "May be " part of the Equation ____________
Made History @ Daytona and still one fast old man!!
quote:Maybe that is the list fish is talking about , being first on the service department list for recall work! Or maybe first on the list of the "clutch petition". Kawi doesnt stand behind thier product very well as far as I can tell. It seems to take intervention from others(Doug or EL) to get what should have been fixed fixed!
CMON ozzy.......Most of the time it's just a lack of communication between us and the dealership and it takes someone like me to get things straightened out...we always stand behind our product as long as we should sometimes even beyond when we should stop.
posted August 07, 2005 10:22 AM
Edited By: fish_antlers on 7 Aug 2005 11:26
quote:.we always stand behind our product as long as we should sometimes even beyond when we should stop.
I'd say that's true about KMC.... however the A1 12R was unique in the sense that it could be considered a "diamond in the rough" .. from cheesey plastic phillips fastners to failing gastanks, clutches, fuel gauges, steering head bearings and the list goes on...
The bike coincided with a unique time in history as the Internet and the Discussion Forum, the Power Commander and several other "new" products and forms of communication were born and became accessible to the general public... all within a period of a year or so. (Note that I'm not suggesting these things werent around before.... but what occured with the A1 and the Internet etc is what could almost be considered a "Critical Mass"... where "Joe Average" finally had the chance have his/ her point of view heard... globally... and the crux of it... people listened )
This magnified the weaknesses of the bike, but also help find solutions (such as Ridgeracer's speed de-restrictor) and CRandall's research into fuel ratios with the PC3... Those solutions were not only capitolized by the aftermarket, but also by the OEMs (KMC included).
To state, with a broad stroke, that KMC didnt "stand behind their product" isnt entirely true... However I would think it would be more than fair to say that KMC was caught "off guard" by the ability for it's customers to network via sites such as Bikeland, and basically complete the R&D for the product that they produced.
It has taken several years of "dealing" with the Internet for KMC and the other OEMs to develope a strategy to "deal" with the Internet, and it's positive and negative impacts. The strategy is nowhere near complete, but there is a form of integration, and people on this site (and others) need to realize that their voices are heard.
The Internet opened a whole new conduit of communication... and it wasnt a trickle... it was a flood...
CKM is another story... perhaps "head in sand" might better describe that division of KHI
____________ What business is it of yours where I'm from, Friendo?
quote:The mere fact that Tren and Blitz are spending a bank roll on their 12's means new
new bigger replacment will come out!!!
You got that right Jere!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It's money in the bank for the rest of us now. I don't know all Bob's plans for his 12, but allow me to say Kawasaki won't build anything as trick as what Trenace is building for many years to come. I'm not even interested in 06 for kawasaki right now I just want to see Trenace's bike finished.
____________ There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
quote:.we always stand behind our product as long as we should sometimes even beyond when we should stop.
I'd say that's true about KMC.... however the A1 12R was unique in the sense that it could be considered a "diamond in the rough" .. from cheesey plastic phillips fastners to failing gastanks, clutches, fuel gauges, steering head bearings and the list goes on...
The bike coincided with a unique time in history as the Internet and the Discussion Forum, the Power Commander and several other "new" products and forms of communication were born and became accessible to the general public... all within a period of a year or so. (Note that I'm not suggesting these things werent around before.... but what occured with the A1 and the Internet etc is what could almost be considered a "Critical Mass"... where "Joe Average" finally had the chance have his/ her point of view heard... globally... and the crux of it... people listened )
This magnified the weaknesses of the bike, but also help find solutions (such as Ridgeracer's speed de-restrictor) and CRandall's research into fuel ratios with the PC3... Those solutions were not only capitolized by the aftermarket, but also by the OEMs (KMC included).
To state, with a broad stroke, that KMC didnt "stand behind their product" isnt entirely true... However I would think it would be more than fair to say that KMC was caught "off guard" by the ability for it's customers to network via sites such as Bikeland, and basically complete the R&D for the product that they produced.
It has taken several years of "dealing" with the Internet for KMC and the other OEMs to develope a strategy to "deal" with the Internet, and it's positive and negative impacts. The strategy is nowhere near complete, but there is a form of integration, and people on this site (and others) need to realize that their voices are heard.
The Internet opened a whole new conduit of communication... and it wasnt a trickle... it was a flood...
CKM is another story... perhaps "head in sand" might better describe that division of KHI
Yea what Fish said!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I wish we would have had this back in the 80's..... For us old timers the internet boards are like gold. You new guys just don't know how hard it was to figure this shit out on you own back in the day.... Rejoyce in the wealth of knowledge being shared.
____________ There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
posted August 07, 2005 10:57 AM
Edited By: 238mph on 7 Aug 2005 11:59
Hold on gunner... what is Trenace building??? I haven't heard much about it....
Top secret or what??? Fess up Tren... what's up???
I'll say that if Kawi does a 14r or larger, I'm in... otherwise, I'll just keep what I have.
And no damn sport tourer either...
____________
Pilot Powers took me to the grave, and brought me back...
posted August 07, 2005 11:16 AM
He's going to have a 12R that's as lite as a 10R and have some good reliable motor work done to boot. Also top shelf suspention parts and a short wheelbase. He's building a bike that has NO limits on the cost to do it right. NO strike that PERFECT is the correct word to use here. Trenace was the only one over at .org even trying to build a better 12. This is a point that pissed me off to the MAX when Dale ask him to leave. The guys at .org are like family to me, but Dale's deep rooted HATE for America, and YES he has that really started to show up. So he attacked Trenace and run off the only guy building a better mouse trap. But hey, I'm sure it will leave more room for guys/ girls who know nuttin about bikes to post about the kinds of shit posers post about.
____________ There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
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posted August 07, 2005 11:34 AM
quote:Also top shelf suspention parts and a short wheelbase.
Hey Trenace! Are you considering using a P series 7R swingarm as part of your plan to shorten the wheelbase or do you have something completely different in mind. Having had done such a swap myself (albeit, with a VERY LIMITED budget), I'm dying to just get some idea (don't expect ya to tell EVERYTHING) on which direction your thinking about going to acomplish the goal of a shorter wheelbase.
____________
There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games.
-Ernest Hemingway
quote:Also top shelf suspention parts and a short wheelbase.
Hey Trenace! Are you considering using a P series 7R swingarm as part of your plan to shorten the wheelbase or do you have something completely different in mind. Having had done such a swap myself (albeit, with a VERY LIMITED budget), I'm dying to just get some idea (don't expect ya to tell EVERYTHING) on which direction your thinking about going to acomplish the goal of a shorter wheelbase.
Hey Elk I'm very interested in what you done there on that arm. What model 7 arm to use and what do you think about the outcome. Trenace is having another arm built to shorten his wheelbase. Trenace has posted everything he's doing to his 12 at one point or another. I'm sure he'll tell you anything you want to know.
____________ There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
quote:The mere fact that Tren and Blitz are spending a bank roll on their 12's means new
new bigger replacment will come out!!!
You got that right Jere!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It's money in the bank for the rest of us now. I don't know all Bob's plans for his 12
I'm spending quite a bit on the rebuild of my 12, but have ruled a few things out.
I was going to put on Marchesini's but ruled that out because my powder coater won't touch magnesium. Powder coating is required for my new paint scheme. I'm not a fan of paint on applications like wheels.
I'm not modifying the stock swingarm short of powder coating and bearing upgrades.
Even though I was fortunate enough to have Mike provide me a full set of plastic for a very fair price, the rebuild has been extremely expensive. For instance the radiator cost over $500 from Ayers. I just shook my head when I priced that one.
I am sure Trenaces 12 is going to turn out very nice because he loves toys. I am curious what all he is doing - he has been very tight lipped about the project, as I have about mine. LOL
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posted August 07, 2005 01:41 PM
quote:Hey Elk I'm very interested in what you done there on that arm. What model 7 arm to use and what do you think about the outcome?
Any P series ('96-'03) 7R swingarm would work.
The short answers on the outcome brought me to these conclusions.
1. The installation is the easy part. Still, this mod is not for the faint of heart or the suspension tuning ignorant (like I was and still kinda am). Not to mention how you'll need a good amount of time to "sort things out". Even if you did take it to a place like GMD.
2. Best if the rear shock is replaced with a Penske or Ohlins. If for any reason, it would be easier to fine tune the ride height.
3. Even with an aftermarket shock, use adjustable dogbones. Trying to guess what the length would be needed on a "drilled" set is too "hit or miss" (most likely... "miss").
4. Might as well have the forks at least revalved and new springs (for those that can not afford a aftermarket set).
5. Put serious thought into your fork location in the triple clamps, oil weight and level.
6. I experimented with a various tire size on both front and back. IMHO, working with a 120/70 up front and a 180/55 on back was the best combination. Your results may vary depending on brand and you might prefer a 190/50 or 190/55. I don't think a 200/50 would work as well. Again, just MHO.
A FEW NOTES:
1. My bike was an '00 A1. Though the 7R swingarm will work on B models too, its a completely different can of worms. I only know of four A models and one B model that has had the mod done to it. There might be more, but those are all I know of. One of those A models was the original French race bike. At least one of the other A models and the only B model have been basically totaled out in crashes.
2. I used the OEM shock and non-adjustable dogbones. Neither was a wise move. The shock had been recharged, but not rebuilt. If I was to do it again, I would have got a Penske instead. You really can not skimp out on this part.
3. Even though I felt I was getting "close", after having the 7R swingarm on for over a year, I felt I never quite got the suspension sorted out to take full advantage of what I had done. I probably would have gotten closer had I known then what I know now about suspension set ups (being the manager/wrench for a CMRA endurance & sprint racing team). Still, I don't know if I would have ever found the "true sweet spot".
4. One need to keep in mind that the bike's overall geometry was designed to be a certain configuration. Changing one aspect of it, even by a small amount (which swapping to a shorter swingarm is NOT A SMALL AMOUNT), will have a major effect on every other aspect as well.
For most of us, it is not practical to alter the frame, but everything from the forks and ride height to tire sizes and chain length (another wheelbase altering aspect) will have to be completely researched and experimented with. Just taking it to some place like GMD ain't gonna cut it. They might be able to give you "numbers", but since nothing like a "7R swingarm shod 12R" exists, they do not have a practical "baseline" that would be applicable. It is all uncharted territory.
Here is a link to one of my threads concerning the swap.
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posted August 07, 2005 01:43 PM
BTW - I traded my 12R in '04 for my 10R.
____________
There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely games.
-Ernest Hemingway
This is where I'm at right now. Business has been good and I have the cash to do it, but I love the 12R. At the same time sinking money into a project that may never be as good as a 10R isn't wise.
____________ There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
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posted August 06, 2005 06:39 PM
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