dougmeyer
Needs a job
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Posts: 2713
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posted May 11, 2005 03:53 PM
Doug,
Yes it was fairly low at idle but jumped right up with any RPM. Your definition of "dry sump" is not correct. Dry Sump means that the oil is removed from the crankcase and stored remotely in a separate tank . The fact that the oil supply pressure is provided by the OEM pump is not relevant to the definition. There really are three major advantages to a dry sump system. The most important (especially in the case of the (drag racing) 12 is that you are guaranteed that the feed pump will receive an uninterrupted supply non aerated of oil at all times. Second, the multiple scavenge pumps effectively evacuate the crankcase to reduce windage and alos produce a vacuum in the air spaces of the engine. Third, you can carry more oil. Six to seven liters is what we tried to achieve in the tanks we built. This helps reduce oil temp and a properly designed tank facilitates the removal of the air bubbles from the oil (de-aeration) before it gets to the pump. If you have data aquisition on your bike you MUST have a channel for oil pressure. As I said, before we had either the Master Lube or the Dry Sump on the ZX-12 Superbike we lost bearings and the data clearly showed why. The pump pickup went dry on launch. when we fixed that by picking up in the back, the pump went dry on decell. (not as serious but still scuffed the bearings). When we provided un-interrupted oil iol by the methods mentioned the pressure NEVER waivered and teh SCARFED UP bearings stopped. It's really that simple. When you get the data be sure you're sittin' down when you look at it......
Johnny,
you're right about the nitriding, in that it's certainly a plus, but the lack of it is not a cause of failure. There are PLENTY of Falicon cranks in use without the benefit of nitriding. As you know, it's only a surface treatment, very hard and quite thin. The primary use is for wear resistance over very long use (like hunderds and thousands of hours). If you have a bad fit or poor lubrication it is of limited (although some) value.
  
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spencercyclecom
Zone Head
Posts: 535
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posted May 11, 2005 05:35 PM
thanks Doug for clearing that up for me....you have always been of great help to me
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Doug Ray
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fish_antlers
Administrator
The Truth is Out There
Posts: 21894
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posted May 14, 2005 10:04 AM
I, for one, am enjoying this topic...
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What business is it of yours where I'm from, Friendo?
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VincentHill
Needs a life
Posts: 6520
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posted May 14, 2005 02:31 PM
Mike, Doug (Both) when I was looking at Brock Davidson,s Billet Opl pan for the Busas, he had something very neat! The oil Pick up "Swings" backward on Accel and forward on Decel! Covered (Actually) both ways!
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Made History @ Daytona and still one fast old man!!
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted May 14, 2005 02:35 PM
brock pan NOT avail for 12 
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your car is slow
Needs a job
Fuck Nitrous...Got Boost?
Posts: 4089
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posted May 14, 2005 02:47 PM
 Edited By: your car is slow on 14 May 2005 15:51
What about the pickup itself? Id like to see what it looks like anyway...since ours is just a plastic tube...id imagine a replacement swing type wouldnt be a big stretch.
NM..no way to get that to work in a stock pan....even a welded one would need all the internal baffling removed for that sort of swing to work.
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted May 14, 2005 06:40 PM
Edited By: entropy on 14 May 2005 19:41
this issue was kicked around heavily with Brock & Koenig; I sent Brock the lower case, oem pan, pick up, and MM did the same with Koenig. Both say the issue is much more complicated than a Busa, they both (for now, reluctantly) declined to go fwd. Small mkt for the 12 is certainly a consideration.
I got a Coby pan which doesn't have a swivel pickup, but does have a way to limit "sloshing". Sorry, I don't have digital pix
Now I just am waiting on a Brock SW; he says I get production #0001 (soon). 
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