posted February 07, 2012 02:37 PM
Was that rider skill or the fact that he 14 has more torque and the zx10's rpm were so low when he started?
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Best: 60ft 1.351 1/8 5.68 mph 123.98 1/4
8.89 mph 151.32
posted February 07, 2012 02:41 PM
i thought the new zx10 are bad ass but get whooped by that much?? maybe he was too easy with throttle so he won't wheelie.. who knows!!
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posted February 07, 2012 03:05 PM
Edited By: 1badzx12r on 7 Feb 2012 23:06
2010 old motor is what you posted ..i'm posting 2011 and 2012 model new motor
____________ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S06nIz4scvI
quote:It looks like you are the one that needs to think before speaking. Mouth writing checks your ass can't cash.
What are you talking about? It was Shane that propositioned me, and in all races negotiations take place prior to the start. This is no different.
Are you expecting me to just agree with every request he makes? Nonsense.
I am of the belief that my weight approx compensates for his power (give or take)....but his added wheelbase puts the advantage squarely in his corner.
If he only wants to run me with a stretch and I've already said I won't stretch than the negotiations continue until we lock in a start speed....which would be dependent on my proposition....and Shane's agreement....right? If neither party agrees the negotiations are null and void and there is usually no race.
So no, I didn't write something my ass can't cash. I am confident in my abilities on my street 12 to know what I can do with it. I have still left quite a bit on the table....just doing a quick walk-around my street 12 will show that. But I think you are misguided in your belief that just because someone doesn't agree to all of the terms a competitor throws out that somehow equates to their ass not being able to cash what they wrote.
By that rationale I could just say "Hey Shane, we have a spot by our area that we could run at, an hour away instead of 1500 miles away, we've run there before, why not run me there?" He already said he doesn't feel comfortable running there. Does that mean he's afraid to run me? No, it means he doesn't feel comfortable running at that spot.
Like I said, think before you speak.
A.
____________
Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
quote:It looks like you are the one that needs to think before speaking. Mouth writing checks your ass can't cash.
What are you talking about? It was Shane that propositioned me, and in all races negotiations take place prior to the start. This is no different.
Are you expecting me to just agree with every request he makes? Nonsense.
I am of the belief that my weight approx compensates for his power (give or take)....but his added wheelbase puts the advantage squarely in his corner.
If he only wants to run me with a stretch and I've already said I won't stretch than the negotiations continue until we lock in a start speed....which would be dependent on my proposition....and Shane's agreement....right? If neither party agrees the negotiations are null and void and there is usually no race.
So no, I didn't write something my ass can't cash. I am confident in my abilities on my street 12 to know what I can do with it. I have still left quite a bit on the table....just doing a quick walk-around my street 12 will show that. But I think you are misguided in your belief that just because someone doesn't agree to all of the terms a competitor throws out that somehow equates to their ass not being able to cash what they wrote.
By that rationale I could just say "Hey Shane, we have a spot by our area that we could run at, an hour away instead of 1500 miles away, we've run there before, why not run me there?" He already said he doesn't feel comfortable running there. Does that mean he's afraid to run me? No, it means he doesn't feel comfortable running at that spot.
Like I said, think before you speak.
A.
easy to see you're scared of Shane, keep begging. lol
quote:Hey Shiteey....the way you speak is that you are the baddest man on the planet. I think I've accomplished quite a bit with my little stock motored 14. Now with that I know LSR is sooooo big these days maybe we will run into each other? All I have to do is look for an outdated 12 and I should find you. Me and probably a few others on here would throw some money my way in a run with you. Let's do 1/4 mile then your 9/10s garbage and see who's the quickest and fastest...any takers?
Definately not the baddest man on the planet, but I do have confidence, experience and a racer spirit. That counts for something. You mentioned you've accomplished quite a bit with your little stock motored 14. Before we continue though maybe I should remind you that I've probably accomplished more on my "even littler" 12. I can back this statement up with facts and events if need be.
Yeah, you can look for a guy on a red zx12. If you see a good looking dog in the pits then you know its me, right? Which LSR venue can I expect to see you at? I'm on the east coast and tend to race at Maxton which is no longer open. That means my "home track" will now be Ohio. But I have been known to frequent Maine.....Texas....and even Bonneville. Not often....but I would imagine I would probably be able to get my outdated 12R out there to run at those alternate venues again one of these days. Then again one or 2 outings at any of the above mentioned venues may be more than any you've ever run. You seem to be pretty confident in your abilities. I admire your fighting spirit and look forward to seeing you out at either one.
And if you would like to only run 1/4 mile and 9/10ths "garbage".....of course you realize you are far from a shotcaller and as with any negotiations both parties must agree, right? That being said I would add a caveat to your 1/4 mile and 9/10ths "garbage" run. I would also include a 1.25 mile run and a 1.5 mile run into the equation. Are you ok with that? Run what you brung? Ride your own ride?
A.
____________
Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
posted February 07, 2012 05:35 PM
Remember, I'm no 100lb jockey, but if you strap 100lbs of weight onto your body, I would race you.
I have tried making my bike consistent, and it is. It's a bracket bike, not a pro street bike.
I will, so long as you remember my bike is giving up 153cc and wheelbase. You can't cry about my weight with the bigger signifiantly larger, easier to launch motor and longer wheelbase. Oh, and I'm not 100 lbs either. I applaud your efforts in making the bike consistent. Personally I have never been a consistent drag racer. One run will be a high 9....lost with a big wheelie....the other run will be a 9.4....then a 9.6. I suppose if I kept at it I would see my consistency level out and my ETs drop a smidge. That would be a normal, natural progression of things. My comment was directed at you because you found it amusing Leonidas thought a 195 mph performance on a stock ride height, stock motor, n/a pump gas run was dismal. If you did some research you would quickly find out that that is no easy feat. In fact, you can do some research and let me know how many 12Rs have gone that fast with that little done. And if you're in this realm you can quickly start figuring it out that its not too far away from going 200. Again, respectable ..... all things considered.
You found his comment funny....when in all reality.....anyone who's done this would actually tell you that is a really good speed. I've consistently done low-mid 190s on a true street setup without relying on race fuel, lowered ride height, significant weight reduction or any motor work. Including night runs where you're outrunning headlights. Now before you go bashing that and misdirect your response....that was a personal choice that I made. But the point was it was done, and very repeatable. Thats respectable. If you don' think so then you're just showing me and others in the know that you really don't "know". Many people think this is easy....and when they come out they get their feelings hurt. I don't disrespect drag racing because I have first hand experience .... I know its hard....I know its tough fighting for years for a fucking tenth....just one tenth. So too.....when we push for just one more mph .... and get it....often times it a big friggin deal. Respect is a 2 way street....if you're jumping on someone's bandwagon for dissing me just remember it comes back. I got respect for you running respectable numbers...if you're over 200 lbs even more. But its a 2 way street.
A.
____________
Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
posted February 07, 2012 05:47 PM
.easy to see you're scared of Shane, keep begging. lol
wee
Hardly, I've jumped into several "handicap" races in my day on the street....I am no stranger to them. In fact because of my size/experience I usually HAVE to just to get someone to even run.
Technically wee, it was you and I that had discussed the possibility of running one another before Shane and I started negotiating. You mentioned living in TX. TX Mile from us 1500 miles. We're both willing to drive 1500 miles down to S. FL to run. What exactly does that say about you again?
It is my honest belief that a true stock wheelbase race would be the most 'level' of races. Both riders needing to harness the power and requiring a higher degree of skill. That is not to say that there is not skill involved in getting a stretched bike to roll. I am fully aware there are suspension issues, tire psi issues, etc to consider. However a stock wheelbase bike, as we both are sitting now....with the motors stock......both running N/A.....would be about as even as we could get. Technically speaking, correct me if I'm wrong the 14R is probably already longer than the 12R but more than just 1/4 inch. There is already an inherent wheelbase advantage between the 2, even with both on the stock arms. I am fully aware of that and am willing to overlook that slight but still noticable advantage over my shorter arm. And wee....you know that an inch or 2...let alone several inches variance between 2 bikes equates to a SEVERAL BIKELENGHTS ADVANTAGE as they come out. I'm simply unwilling to have to "defacto" have to play "catchup". These aren't excuses....because you don't see me saying shane is making excuses to not run me in our own neck of the woods....or up and terminating negotiations just because he is requesting a stretch. If he has less wheelies, I will look for the exact same advantage. Your inherent and obvious bias is so transparent is isn't even funny.
A.
____________
Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
easy to see you're scared of Shane, keep begging. lol
wee
Hardly, I've jumped into several "handicap" races in my day on the street....I am no stranger to them. In fact because of my size/experience I usually HAVE to just to get someone to even run.
Technically wee, it was you and I that had discussed the possibility of running one another before Shane and I started negotiating. You mentioned living in TX. TX Mile from us 1500 miles. We're both willing to drive 1500 miles down to S. FL to run. What exactly does that say about you again?
It is my honest belief that a true stock wheelbase race would be the most 'level' of races. Both riders needing to harness the power and requiring a higher degree of skill. That is not to say that there is not skill involved in getting a stretched bike to roll. I am fully aware there are suspension issues, tire psi issues, etc to consider. However a stock wheelbase bike, as we both are sitting now....with the motors stock......both running N/A.....would be about as even as we could get. Technically speaking, correct me if I'm wrong the 14R is probably already longer than the 12R but more than just 1/4 inch. There is already an inherent wheelbase advantage between the 2, even with both on the stock arms. I am fully aware of that and am willing to overlook that slight but still noticable advantage over my shorter arm. And wee....you know that an inch or 2...let alone several inches variance between 2 bikes equates to a SEVERAL BIKELENGHTS ADVANTAGE as they come out. I'm simply unwilling to have to "defacto" have to play "catchup". These aren't excuses....because you don't see me saying shane is making excuses to not run me in our own neck of the woods....or up and terminating negotiations just because he is requesting a stretch. If he has less wheelies, I will look for the exact same advantage. Your inherent and obvious bias is so transparent is isn't even funny.
A. just run Shane from a 70 mph punch your 12 against his 14r..
quote:I have to say, this thread is entertaining....and they seem to come along every winter.
Now, on a more serious note....
Real 9/10th's roll-on racing does require a lot of skill....in both setup and rider technique. People have this misconception that all you do is twist the grip and put your head down. Not true at all...there are many setup and rider technique variables to account for. The 9/10th's racing in Florida has proven to be a challenge for talented drag racers, just as the reverse is true. We are talking about speeds of easily 190+ mph in this particular race, speeds that most riders here have never seen (except perhaps on their speedo's). Note that I said "most", not all...
Now, the "negotiations" between Shiphteey and I are pretty simple to understand. Shiphteey is a lightweight and skilled rider at this type of racing. Hell, he probably has 200x more experience topping these bikes out compared to me, if not more.
Neither one of us are noobs though, and we realize where each other might have an advantage in this race. I need to overcome 90+ lbs of weight difference and his experience, and he needs to overcome 25 hp and perhaps better overall setup. Even the bikes have their own set of strengths and weaknesses. Both of us have a chance to win...if we negotiate the terms in our favor. This type of thread has been an almost annual event for us...but we can never come to agree on terms.
Simple, right?
Shane
Well put actually. And on that note, given its Feb 2012 and neither of us will realisitcally be going to the 9/10ths "right now"....more likely what will happen is we will both see what the other runs in Ohio in April and go from there. Negotiations are not over, of course, and anyone who's actually raced me on the street or knows me knows I'm always down for street shit.....felony eludings, suspended licenses and jailtime be damned.
A.
____________
Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
quote:It looks like you are the one that needs to think before speaking. Mouth writing checks your ass can't cash.
What are you talking about? It was Shane that propositioned me, and in all races negotiations take place prior to the start. This is no different.
Are you expecting me to just agree with every request he makes? Nonsense.
I am of the belief that my weight approx compensates for his power (give or take)....but his added wheelbase puts the advantage squarely in his corner.
If he only wants to run me with a stretch and I've already said I won't stretch than the negotiations continue until we lock in a start speed....which would be dependent on my proposition....and Shane's agreement....right? If neither party agrees the negotiations are null and void and there is usually no race.
So no, I didn't write something my ass can't cash. I am confident in my abilities on my street 12 to know what I can do with it. I have still left quite a bit on the table....just doing a quick walk-around my street 12 will show that. But I think you are misguided in your belief that just because someone doesn't agree to all of the terms a competitor throws out that somehow equates to their ass not being able to cash what they wrote.
By that rationale I could just say "Hey Shane, we have a spot by our area that we could run at, an hour away instead of 1500 miles away, we've run there before, why not run me there?" He already said he doesn't feel comfortable running there. Does that mean he's afraid to run me? No, it means he doesn't feel comfortable running at that spot.
Like I said, think before you speak.
A.
I'm thinking this time, I'm thinking you are all talk. Like I said, one thread you talk down to Shane tell him how you stomp his ass with your stock 12R with all of his money in his bikes, blah blah blah, but now you want something. It is as simple as that. But I am done, I know it is winter, but you bore me.
____________
2008 ZX14
Never argue with a fool, onlookers may not be able to tell the difference. ~Mark Twain
posted February 07, 2012 06:01 PM
shiphteey I think you and shane both want the same thing ... 9/10 race with a slow roll start at 40 MPH in first gear... I have a ZX14R so i know what happens at 40 MPH in first gear at stock wheel base ..No matter how easy you twist the throttle the bike goes 12:00 O"clock ... Race over for the ZX14R ... Your zx12 will just roll way from him while he watchs you drive away .. If shane goes to lets say 62 inch wheel base it will still do the same thing or it will blow the tire off .. If he goes 64 inches he will do nothing but spin for 9/10s of a mile ..This bike is very very hard to ride fast .. Look how many runs Ricky had to do to get a handle on the power and put down a good run at stock wheel base ..And he is a Pro .. I know you have not rode the new zx14 yet but it's as hard to ride as Roys 1530 bike and you have rode that bike pleanty ..So the way i see it you can give him all the wheel base he wants because it not going to help him ( not on the street anyway ).. At a sticky track it will but you guys are talking on the street .. I only see one fair way to pull this off , both bikes in 2 gear at 60 MPH roll, both bikes stock wheel base ... Run the full 9/10s ..
____________
Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
posted February 07, 2012 06:08 PM
just run Shane from a 70 mph punch your 12 against his 14r..
wee
-----Not until I actually go test it. You expect me to not have tried one roll from 70 mph WOT and just agree to drive 1500 miles to just "try it" and see what happens? Get real. Maybe something you don't understand being much heavier than I am....that while maybe the bike might be more wheelie prone out the gate with a heavier rider because of the higher center of gravity....that weight can be an advantage in terms of keeping the front wheel down from an initial "hit". I have already done some WOT runs from around that speed stock ride height and still fight wheelies on the "little old" 12. I had to play with the throttle while my buddy on this lowered stretched Busa would jump out. Once I was able to WOT we locked up. If we had started from a high enough speed where we could both PIN IT WOT then we would have been pretty damn even. Again, I doubt someone your size would understand. That shit probably never happens to you.
Smokin has enough cred on here. Go ahead and let smokin run stock wheelbase stock ride height and then you run it. You probably don't have the same wheelie issues. Now put Smokin on a stock arm 12 and put you on a new 14R stretched out. Think you won't ET him? Clearly he is one of the most talented riders on this site, no question about that. But even he would tell you there comes a point where you just can't give up too much and expect to just magically "catch up". Say he goes mid-upper 1.5s on the stock arm and you go 1.4s stretched. You're out the gate immediately. And yes he's lighter but you have more power....see where I'm going with this wee? Of course you do.
A.
____________
Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
quote:just run Shane from a 70 mph punch your 12 against his 14r..
wee
-----Not until I actually go test it. You expect me to not have tried one roll from 70 mph WOT and just agree to drive 1500 miles to just "try it" and see what happens? Get real. Maybe something you don't understand being much heavier than I am....that while maybe the bike might be more wheelie prone out the gate with a heavier rider because of the higher center of gravity....that weight can be an advantage in terms of keeping the front wheel down from an initial "hit". I have already done some WOT runs from around that speed stock ride height and still fight wheelies on the "little old" 12. I had to play with the throttle while my buddy on this lowered stretched Busa would jump out. Once I was able to WOT we locked up. If we had started from a high enough speed where we could both PIN IT WOT then we would have been pretty damn even. Again, I doubt someone your size would understand. That shit probably never happens to you.
Smokin has enough cred on here. Go ahead and let smokin run stock wheelbase stock ride height and then you run it. You probably don't have the same wheelie issues. Now put Smokin on a stock arm 12 and put you on a new 14R stretched out. Think you won't ET him? Clearly he is one of the most talented riders on this site, no question about that. But even he would tell you there comes a point where you just can't give up too much and expect to just magically "catch up". Say he goes mid-upper 1.5s on the stock arm and you go 1.4s stretched. You're out the gate immediately. And yes he's lighter but you have more power....see where I'm going with this wee? Of course you do.
A.
just say you don't want to race Shane. btw, I have good credit too.
posted February 07, 2012 06:16 PM
Smokin, I'm listening to you, I hear ya. But at 60 mph I can't "make him" go into 2nd and I shouldn't be "forced" to go into.
I have done 2nd gear rolls at those speeds....the 12R doesn't go anywhere. This bike is made to be redlined at about 83 mph in 1st gear. 12R doesn't have torque. It just don't go. I've already done that with a 1340 busa....it jumps out every time and we lock up. Shane has 101 ccs more than that, he will probably jump more.
I am 100% a fan of stock wheelbase. I won't make him do anything he doesn't want to. And while the 14 is still a "beast" in terms of power the power comes on much smoother than the stubbier wheelibased, lighter flywheel 12R. Even Shane can admit that, he's ridden my A model years ago, they require much more technique than an 02+ model to get going from down low.
For the record you said if he hits from 40 mph in 1st he'll flip over. I can flip mine over at 60 mph if I just went WOT. I almost did that with 148 RWHP stock filter/pipes/ride height racing a Turbo Busa earlier 2011 when I first resurrected this street 12. Thats why roll-ons aren't always as "easy" as some of the other guys were trying to make them out to be. I think if we're both slammed in the weeds in 1st gear there will be minimal wheelie issues...and by the time we're both in 2nd I'm sure we'll be pinned to the stops, may the best man win.
A.
____________
Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
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posted February 07, 2012 02:37 PM
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