Rickey Gadson
Expert Class
Posts: 253
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posted October 14, 2011 03:23 PM
let's clear the air about the 2012 ZX14 VS Busa head to head showdown
I've been reading statements made on this forum concerning the validity of the HEAD to HEAD race against the Busa!
To start this off, I don't think the fans understand how SLOW racing in Vegas really is!
My school bikes were shipped out to Vegas last Oct and they run 8.80 to 8.84 153 to 154 here on the east coast. Even I was slapped in the face with the brick wall I hit, when my time slip showed a depressing 9.20's at 146-147 at the Vegas racetrack.
Now that we have that out the way, I first want to clear the air for people who wonder wjether I was laying down on the Busa?? HELL NOOOO!
The run the editors(not part of Kawasaki) showed was the VERY 1st run I made on a Suzuki since 2008 when I tested the Busa against the 2008 14 at ATCO raceway(just weeks after Richard ran 9.34 on Brocks 08 Busa).
Back in 08 I rode both bikes in a closed test session with BUSA and 14 lowered,strapped and geared with stock exhaust.
The test resulted in me running 9.20 151 on the Busa and 9.23 150 on the ZX14 by virtue of the Busa having a Brocks clutch mod and being easier to launch 1.50 to 1.52 60ft.
This time( Sept 2012) the Busa had no mod which meant the clutch was inconsistent.
I am not sure why they chose to show my 1st pass but I don't think they were taping when I rode the bike and ran a best of 10.04 143.01 with a 1.72 60ft compared to the 1.68 on the big Ninja.
They were Busy trying to get the Helicopter to work when I finally ran the 10.04. I thought I would have time later to try again when the cameras were rolling but obviously we ran out of time.
The other rider that they claim went a best of 10.15 on the 14, actually ran a best of 9.99 on the Ninja,and a best of 10.03 142 on the BUSA, but again they said he went slower than he actually did because the cameras were not rolling and they couldn't rewind it when they got back to the studios.
There is no way I would brag about going 9.72 if it were here on the east coast, but in Vegas where it took a 125 pound rider (50 pounds smaller than me) to break into the nines 9.97 143 back in 2006 at the ZX14 press intro and a RYAN SCHNITZ (120 pounds at the time) to run 9.65 at that same intro where I could only pull of a 9.96 142 run in the Vegas altitude.
PS- I have yet to ride the new 14 with even a strap on it!! I have ONLY ridden it in the 1/8th mile.............once, in Barona(outside San Diego) when I went 6.34 118..........NO STRAP!!
And then at Vegas.............where they didn't even record my 9.72 148mph run. I went 9.72 the last 3 runs of the night in 100 degree weather and hotlapping the bike so much that my last run was at 218 degrees before I left the line. This bike runs just as fast at 218 degrees as it does at 165 degrees!
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Rickey Gadson
   
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kawasakijockey
Pro
Posts: 1876
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posted October 14, 2011 03:30 PM
Everybody is just pissed you didnt run 8.50's at swb on the 14.......
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Get on the shortbus boys 'cause its time to get schooled.
2007 ZX-14
1.38 60ft
9.03 @ 149mph
8.95 @153 small shot n2o
8.68 @160mph 5lbs boost
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Compton
Zone Head
Posts: 969
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posted October 14, 2011 03:37 PM
Rickey G, Rickey G.
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b.w.
zx14, little longer, little louder, little lower.
08 Busa, just a little longer and louder and lower than the 14
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LeoVinceZX14
Expert Class
Thankfully...its paid for...
Posts: 386
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posted October 14, 2011 03:52 PM
Clearing the air...thanks Ricky G.
Ricky:
Too bad you couldn't have run somewhere close to home with cool east coast air, personally I get it, 9 nines in 100 degrees at attitude. That said, I am confident Kawi got it right this time with the 14R and trust that you would give us 14 people the real truth about the bike's potential. Truth is if you had run a super quick time at a sea level track then some people would be complaining the...other way. Me, just scraping up my $ to get one. A year down the line when the bikes are on the road and 200 rwhp with a pipe and good tune is....easy every one will be happy.
thanks,
Leo Vince
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'12 14R SE
PC V
Custom map
BMC filter
Leo Vince 4-2-1 w/ carbon can
Sato frame sliders
Supersprox 42T
Cox radiator guard
DID 530 X-ring chain.
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Jeffrey Peck
Novice Class
Old School Racer X
Posts: 52
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posted October 14, 2011 07:15 PM
Well put Rick! I think the Busa following just won't believe what you did to the Busa in Vegas until one of the guys they know buys a 14R and kicks there but. They will believe then. Thats what it took in 1990 when the Zx11 came out and the zx12 was a hand full to ride but it too could beat Busa's. Rider is 90% of it. This new 14R will be the proof of all the speculation that Kawasaki is back and they want the reputation of being the fastest bike in the universe title once again! Hail to the King of speed, Kawasaki
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Kawasaki Proud!
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almost_les
Zone Head
Posts: 590
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posted October 14, 2011 07:19 PM
lol, and everyone around here (SLC) goes nuts about how FAST vegas is. all a matter of perspective
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smokinZX14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted October 14, 2011 07:28 PM
Ricky please Get Brock a new ZX14R to test .. All this can get put to rest real fast !! The Busa guys will believe Brocks testing and numbers ..
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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kaw-rick
Pro
Posts: 1167
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posted October 14, 2011 07:28 PM
That statement makes me feel way better. thank you.
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justoyz2
Zone Head
Justoyz Racing
Posts: 858
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posted October 14, 2011 10:40 PM
Smokin,
Why would they believe Brock, when most of them don't believe him on the BMW..... He mentioned that Destiny went 8:4ish on a BMW, without a fuel management system, BST or air shifter. or clutch mod or having her bike maintained........ If what he says is true, then his products with a pro rider mounted is worthless....
INTEGRITY is everything to me.... I believe Rg, because he hasn't been proven to to lie about a new bike or any conversation that we have had..... Brock has integrity as well, but I don't know him..... personnally ...... both guys have an invested interested in these ventures..... but they are different. Rg isnt' selling bike nor products, however he does endorse product; which some of them are Brock's product..... So, if you trust Brock and don't trust Rg.... what are you saying when?
Rg and I camped and raced this past year at the MFG cup racing... There were no tuners nor mechanics as in the past.... just him and Richard.... Yeah Kawi pays him to advertise their new platforms and as a spoke for what he is exposed to........
I know many of you will eat CROW, when you learn of the dyno numbers for this new platform... learn to listen....... reread what people in the know has already told you about the bike. The information is already at hand..... Brock is not the say all/end all...
FYI, the bike will be available in NOVEMBER early DECEMBER.... orders are being placed now......
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2012 zx14R-blue,2012 zx14R-black, 2014 zx14Trbo, 2011 zx10R, 2007 zx10 Turbo.....
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1badzx12r
Needs a life
Posts: 8321
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posted October 15, 2011 04:36 AM
They all full of shit because bottom line MONEY.. Just like politicians get your vote and fukk you in the ass ..
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S06nIz4scvI
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Lucky14
Pro
Posts: 1439
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posted October 15, 2011 05:10 AM
Rickey,
Can you please post time slips for both the 14R and the Busa?
If that has already been done, can someone please point me to them?
............... and thanks for all the prior information posted!
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You only need two tools: WD-40 and Duct Tape.
If it doesn't move and should, use the WD-40.
If it shouldn't move and does, use the duct tape.
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smokinZX14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted October 15, 2011 06:25 AM
quote:
Smokin,
Why would they believe Brock, when most of them don't believe him on the BMW..... He mentioned that Destiny went 8:4ish on a BMW, without a fuel management system, BST or air shifter. or clutch mod or having her bike maintained........ If what he says is true, then his products with a pro rider mounted is worthless....
INTEGRITY is everything to me.... I believe Rg, because he hasn't been proven to to lie about a new bike or any conversation that we have had..... Brock has integrity as well, but I don't know him..... personnally ...... both guys have an invested interested in these ventures..... but they are different. Rg isnt' selling bike nor products, however he does endorse product; which some of them are Brock's product..... So, if you trust Brock and don't trust Rg.... what are you saying when?
Rg and I camped and raced this past year at the MFG cup racing... There were no tuners nor mechanics as in the past.... just him and Richard.... Yeah Kawi pays him to advertise their new platforms and as a spoke for what he is exposed to........
I know many of you will eat CROW, when you learn of the dyno numbers for this new platform... learn to listen....... reread what people in the know has already told you about the bike. The information is already at hand..... Brock is not the say all/end all...
FYI, the bike will be available in NOVEMBER early DECEMBER.... orders are being placed now......
At this point all i want is SOMEONE to put this bike on a 250 I Dyno and give us some numbers .Take it to the track strapped and lowered with a few different riders and give us some numbers. Brock , Ricky ,Rob Muzzy , Coby Adams or Homer Simson doesn't matter to me , just get it done ...
If Ricky feels it makes more HP that Kawi is claiming , then he should put it on his Dyno and show us .. He has a Dyno , he has a bike , how hard can it be to test it ..
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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smokinZX14
Needs a life
Posts: 10197
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posted October 15, 2011 07:06 AM
Ricky for some reason Justoyz2 feels i'm picking on you , I'm not .. I love everything you have done so far with the new zx14r .. The videos were great.. I can't talk for the other guys but i believe you about the new zx14 beating the gen 2 busa hands down .. My 06 and 09 zx14 had no problems taking out the gen 2 busa .. 1441 cc, 4 mill stroker , ported head and bigger cams you would have to fall off the bike at the starting line to lose to a gen 2 busa ..
Here is where i have a problem .. The hp numbers.. Kawi claimed 210 at the crank , last years zx14 203 HP and the crank .. 7 HP gain ? No way a 4 mill stroke , head work and bigger cams make only 7 hp .. Now you have stated that you feel that number is understated and i believe you are right .. I feel it has to be a 20 HP gain , maybe more ..
All i'm asking is put the bike on your dyno and show us the numbers .. Let Brock toss it on his dyno and back up your numbers .. Even if the dyno numbers are a little different we can Avg the numbers a get a good idea of the output..
Ricky the guys here love the new bike and are ready to plunk down the cash for one ( that includes me ) , But the one thing that holds us back is real HP numbers..
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Smokin Performance Cycles..
Tampa Bay , FL .. Brocks Performance Dealer ..
Gen 2 ZX14R Best ET 8.43 , Best MPH 164.95
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justoyz2
Zone Head
Justoyz Racing
Posts: 858
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posted October 15, 2011 07:50 AM
Smokin,
It's not that I feel or think, it's what you are showing.... As I mentioned to you before you are a leader on this forum, you denied that; however when Brock posted his comments... you did exactly what he wanted... I mentioned the situation about Brock and new bikes, then he posted nearly everything I said in his message to the forum.
I don't care if members on this forum agree with me or not.... I have posted how I see it, and nearly everything I have suggested is coming true.....
I believe everyone has a right to voice their opinion and reqardless of what is said, we can not go after their character.... INTEGRITY is important to me as well as Rg & Brock aswell... Neither one of us will post an honest LIE.... (check your messages)
JTR Inc
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2012 zx14R-blue,2012 zx14R-black, 2014 zx14Trbo, 2011 zx10R, 2007 zx10 Turbo.....
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Slowninja
Expert Class
Slow-ride
Posts: 189
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posted October 15, 2011 08:13 AM
I'd like to be one of the ones testing the new zx14 with the pros. I'm an average rider 
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06 zx14
SWB
9.24 @ 148
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trganey
Expert Class
Posts: 196
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posted October 15, 2011 09:47 AM
quote:
I'd like to be one of the ones testing the new zx14 with the pros. I'm an average rider
Yeah,,,,,,,,,,, and if they need a fat ass to test one to see how it does with a big boy on it's back they can fix me up with one. I'd be sure to do real nice write ups about my experiences with it and even let them have it back after a while.
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ZX14Mike
Zone Head
Posts: 891
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posted October 15, 2011 01:45 PM
quote:
Smokin,
It's not that I feel or think, it's what you are showing.... As I mentioned to you before you are a leader on this forum, you denied that; however when Brock posted his comments... you did exactly what he wanted... I mentioned the situation about Brock and new bikes, then he posted nearly everything I said in his message to the forum.
I don't care if members on this forum agree with me or not.... I have posted how I see it, and nearly everything I have suggested is coming true.....
I believe everyone has a right to voice their opinion and reqardless of what is said, we can not go after their character.... INTEGRITY is important to me as well as Rg & Brock aswell... Neither one of us will post an honest LIE.... (check your messages)
JTR Inc
JTR I dont think anyone is insulting Rickey or calling him a liar, just like Smokin I love the video's and info Rickey has put out there and think Rickey is a great guy..........that said I want verifiable facts and specific numbers from MANY sources.............Rickey says he "thinks" the horsepower is underated from the factory and I would tend to agree as does Smokin from what he has posted that all those changes SHOULD yield at least 20 horsepower...........I "think" Rickey is probably right that the horsepower is underated and this bike is the real deal.
Trouble is I dont want to "speculate" or "think" this bike is what I'm looking for I want to "KNOW" its what I'm looking for and to really know I need specific numbers such as same day dynos against Gen 1 ZX14's and Gen 2 Busa's and same day dragraces with Gen 1 Zx 14's and Gen 2 Busa's with many different riders preferably ones from this Forum who are skilled, consistent and who are not affiliated with Kawasaki. I get the feeling this bike is gonna be a beast just like Rickey says............I dont think they could think of pricing it at $15K in this economy if it didnt deliver but I have consistently stated for the last 2 years that it would take at least 20 extra horsepower to get me to buy a new bike and I'm NOT gonna pony up 14K-15K until I KNOW not THINK its what i'm looking for............10 RWHP just wont cut it for me, Kawasaki could EASILY build a 1441 that produces 40 extra horsepower reliably so 20 extra RWHP isnt too much to ask for a 15K bike, any less just says Kawasaki is trying to nickle and dime us with small incremental refinements rather that bold bar raising leaps and real innovation.
I just dont think its that outrageous to want real verifiable facts and specific numbers rather than speculation and conjecture before buying a 15K bike.
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kneedragon1962
Novice Class
Posts: 36
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posted October 16, 2011 05:34 AM
Ricky, thanks for posting that reply and clarification. It does clear up several things I wondered about.
If I implied that you were running slow on the 'busa on purpose, I apologise and take it back.
My other concerns about how representative that test was, I think, are valid.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XDo_FIWeDNk
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mathews
Expert Class
Posts: 425
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posted October 16, 2011 06:33 AM
The other rider that they claim went a best of 10.15 on the 14, actually ran a best of 9.99 on the Ninja,and a best of 10.03 142 on the BUSA. So the 14 was .04 faster than the Busa.Or 3 tenths and 5 mph faster than an older 14?I dont understand
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justoyz2
Zone Head
Justoyz Racing
Posts: 858
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posted October 16, 2011 07:18 AM
Mike,
I am not trying tell you how to spend your money. The only reason I posted what I did, is because many on this forum believe that other sources will provide them the truth...
I just answered Smokin because he included me in a post to Rg.
I wouldn't blame anyone if they chose to wait on hard numbers from mags or folks with bike that took them to local dynos. It's your money spend it how you please (you earned it).
When it comes down between the 14r and the 14, there are no comparisons...... I don't need to know just how much faster it is over the previous generation.... I only mentioned the HP of the zx10, because Kawi posted a crank hp of 210. I use a formula that kinda give you a benchmark on valvetrain loss. 180 on a 1k vs 180 on a 14, but adding the +40 lbtq, that makes a difference. The zx10 #s are 18ish w/79 to 82 lbtq......
By the time the bike is released everyone will know what's what.... right now if you aren't in the know.... then you have to wait and see.... I will bet when the #s are released the dealerships are not going to budge on the MSRP.
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2012 zx14R-blue,2012 zx14R-black, 2014 zx14Trbo, 2011 zx10R, 2007 zx10 Turbo.....
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted October 16, 2011 07:34 AM
this is coming from a guy who spent nearly 10 years developing a 12, then recently switched to mountainmotor Busas, so take it for what it's worth...
It seems that the new 14 is a significant step up and will likely crush the Gen2 Busa, street trim vs street trim.
The last couple years, i have been fortunate enough to participate in 2 LandSpeed events and spend 3 days at each pitted next to Rickey, Rickey+Richard. In those 6 days, i didn't hear him one time exaggerate Kawasaki vs anything else, and he has ridden everything. Most even minded, soft spoken expert I know.
Rickey says the new 14 purely kicks ass, and i take that to the bank.
If i wanted the fastest unmodified street bike (i don't), i would already have a deposit on the new 14.
Karl
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This moderator uses moderation in moderation
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NinjaNick
Needs a job
'08 ZX14 (Blue)
Posts: 4558
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posted October 16, 2011 08:12 AM
 Edited By: NinjaNick on 16 Oct 2011 17:26
The beemer and the 10 are the most feared these days at the strip in stock trim I've been told. The power to weight ratio is just too much to contend with. Then again those bikes are too small for my frame. haha.
Agree, same here.
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entropy
Moderator
Posts: 8671
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posted October 16, 2011 08:40 AM
quote:
The beemer and the 10 are the most feared these days at the strip in stock trim I've been told. The power to weight ratio is just too much to contend with. Then again those bikes are too small for my frame. haha.
yup, at 6'3" 220#, i feel like a monkey fukkin' a football on the 1000's.
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This moderator uses moderation in moderation
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted October 16, 2011 10:10 AM
there is a beemer at numidia in good air running high 9.3s in drag trim i think about 6 to 8" over. just normal drag stuff i notice.
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted October 16, 2011 10:12 AM
oh rick, i will run one (new 14r) for a normal guy number. i would love to see if i can beat my 9.25 on my stock engine 12 at cecil on a cold day with the new 14r.
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