reckless
Novice Class
Posts: 60
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posted September 01, 2007 08:01 AM
Framesliders and crashing
Dropped the bike near the end of our two week vacation. Lowsided into the bank at the side of the road, We are OK but the bike didn;t do so well, broken handle bar etc.
Get the bike home and appraised, it's a write-off. Main reason the frameslider on the right side broke off both the frame mount and the head mount when the bike hit the bank. The left frameslider did it's job perfectly, no real damage.
My question is this. Are framesliders mainly for track use where the bike has room to slide to a stop without hitting curbs, banks or other solid objects? Should I put framesliders on the new bike?
Any input appreciated.
http://pic70.picturetrail.com/VOL1873/9759353/17688429/275665252.jpg
http://pic70.picturetrail.com/VOL1873/9759353/17688429/275665269.jpg
  
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bigdtd
Needs a job
Interceptors
Posts: 4209
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posted September 01, 2007 08:13 AM
 Edited By: bigdtd on 1 Sep 2007 09:13
i think most frame sliders protect plastic only for a 0 mph drop. in your case and others i've heard about, the slider causes frame and motor mount damage that would not happen without the slider being bolted there and catching on something during the crash.
i have seen beefier sliders that have a rear mount and connecting bar (crash bars). I don't like the way any of them look. i haven't had sliders or crash bars on any bike i've owned.
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2006 Black ZX-14,6 inches over,16/42, flies out,BMC Street Filter,Brock's Street Meg,Brock's Radial Mount Strap,PClll with Race map,Dynojet LCD w/Techmount, ZX-14 fender eliminator,Pilot Power2CTs,Speedohealer,Pazzo Levers,Cox Radiator Guard, Garmin Nuvi 265WT
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kc jr 54
Expert Class
Fat Guy
Posts: 173
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posted September 01, 2007 12:53 PM
I have the race Railz and think that they offer the best protection for low sides and most high sides. But looking at your photos, the only thing that would have saved yoru bike would have been no slider at all, or atleast a Carbon one. I cant remember who makes them, but they are designed to break off in a incident like this. But they also have a rep of snapping on a low-side too, so really it is just a Huge Catch 22.
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dubious
Needs a life
Needs more time to ride!
Posts: 8442
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posted September 01, 2007 01:00 PM
Fame sliders are meant for parking lots and driveways... 0-MPH only IMO.
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FasterThanStink
Pro
Posts: 1218
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posted September 01, 2007 06:03 PM
quote:
Fame sliders are meant for parking lots and driveways... 0-MPH only IMO.
Yup. Also for the track where you just slide without hitting curbs etc. If you lowside that is.:P
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Speed has never killed anyone,
suddenly becoming stationary...
That's what gets you.
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Jim K
Expert Class
Posts: 141
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posted September 01, 2007 06:25 PM
I've often wondered about how the mounting points of these "frame sliders" hold up during an impact... I guess we know the answer to that question. Scratched plastic is one thing but a broken cylinder head or block is entirely another thing!!!
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Never did get the whole "Harley" thing!
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dubious
Needs a life
Needs more time to ride!
Posts: 8442
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posted September 01, 2007 10:05 PM
Chances are ...
either the bike falls over, or slides at parking lot speeds the frame slider will help ya.
Chances are....
at speed the bike would be so fubarred that with or without sliders, you will hope you had full coverage.... insurance!.... and leathers of course.
Likely it would have been a write off at speed whether it has sliders or not... highsides, curbs, banks, bike flips, cars run onto sliding bike etc etc...
sliders or not , usually it is a write off at speed, unless your on a track and it stays on its side when you low side, even then they have a funny way of hooking shit and beating themselves to pieces.
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NinjaNick
Needs a job
'08 ZX14 (Blue)
Posts: 4558
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posted September 01, 2007 10:44 PM
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nightmare
Pro
ACP Racing
Posts: 1797
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posted September 02, 2007 05:57 AM
Holy shit man! Please be careful dawg! Looks like a nasty fall. Glad to see you are ok though! Way to be a cowboy!
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2006 ZX14 Ninja "SWINE FLU"
60ft 1.23
8th Mile 5.16
ACP Racing
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reckless
Novice Class
Posts: 60
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posted September 02, 2007 01:50 PM
That's the thing Nightmare, it wasn't a "nasty" crash from our point of view. It was a slow speed lowside on a downhill corner. We were both wearing Joe Rocket vented jackets, fabric, not leather and Belstaff cordura riding pants. I have a 2inch tear in the left sleeve of my jacket and several inch sized holes worn through the pants. (places where the pads inside the pants rubbed mainly). My girlfriend's jacket is scuffed on the sleeve but not torn and she has a 1 inch tear on the left ass cheek of her pants. We both stopped quite quickly when we fell off and other than a chipped bone in the little finger of my right hand suffered no damage. The bike on the other hand seemed to gain speed and thump the side of the road with a great deal of enthusiasm.
I fully expected to walk over to the bike after hugging the girlfriend, haul the bike back onto the road, call myself stupid and lucky and ride on with a scratched ugly looking bike. I had no idea that the bike could sustain that much damage so easily or that once the insurance company assessed the bike that they would write it off.
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stevewfl
Moderator
Posts: 27920
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posted September 02, 2007 10:56 PM
I told everyone after the 14 came out and when everyone went crazy over the Muzzy frame sliders I looked at how/where they're mounted and said "EXPECT TOTALED BIKES as a result."
Lets figure we have a super-strength bolt screwed in WHERE in the ZX14 frame? Of course frames are going to be totaled as a result of these sliders, how could they not???
And the comment above about sliders being for parking lots only is erroneous. Come watch all the bikes go down on the race track on any weekend and you'll be sold on frame sliders at extreme speed. But the design for the ZX14 is totally dangerous, I can't believe folks use them.
As far as race rails, I have seen them on the R1 but not the 14. If its anything like on the R1, I can see where they stand a chance of saving the bike WITHOUT totalling the bike such as the "sliders" I've seen for the 14.
Maybe I should dig my old threads where I warned folks way back when they first came out these do NOT look safe for the 14 and look like they are there to DESTROY the 14. I said instead of scratched/damaged plastics expect totalled bikes.
____________
2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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stevewfl
Moderator
Posts: 27920
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posted March 01, 2008 09:49 PM
BEWARE - NOTE LINE 4 WHEN "THINKING" A STRONGER BOLT IS BEST
Now for quick bullet points about sliders:
1. They are not designed to protect plastics, clipons, or rearsets, even though they might help sometimes.
2. You do not want a slider to stick out too far or it will help flip your bike in a crash by snagging on the ground, curb, or anything else.
3. You want delrin or plastic to touch down when you crash as they will grind off and not catch on anything and if hit hard enough or direct enough they will shatter.
4. If your slider shatters, grinds off, or bends then it did it's job. You don't want it solid after a crash or it didn't absorb any energy but merely transfered it on to what you bolted it to.
5. When f1 cars hit the side of a track they explode as they don't want the drive to absorb the energy. Frame sliders are the same way. You want them to stay attached but get beat up and take the energy.
6. If the bolt on a frame slider bends that's a good thing as the only other option is to put the energy on the frame or mounting point. Better the bolt bends. Also if it didn't bend it might have flip the bike by snagging something. A mangled frame slider, but still on the bike, did it's job.
7. No cut frame sliders aren't a direct bolt on like cut sliders as they often have a bracket, but they are still great frame sliders.
8. If you buy cut sliders realize it might hurt you if you ever try and sell your bike because the new owner can't take off your sliders w/o having a hole left in his bodywork.
9. Don't spend a ton on sliders as they are only a safeguard, if your bike goes end over end then the sliders will do nothing. They are only a precaution as 9 times out of 10 they pay off and save you money in the end.
____________
2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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kikonzx14
Pro
Novice
Posts: 1813
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posted March 02, 2008 06:48 PM
Hi reckless, I'm sorry to hear what happened to you, but thank God you and your girlfriend are doing ok. I was wondering about installing sliders on my new bike (I just got it last Thursday), but after reading the posts I'm not sure about really doing it. It might have saved my stupidity today, as I scuffed the right side belly pan cause I was adjusting the mirrors while standing on the bike on a slope and suddenly my Baby "decided" to try a new position (probably she thought lying on her right side would be very sexy.....DARN!). Hugs, and good luck with the new bike.
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Feel the need for SPEED2007 ZX-14 Black with Red Flames (Helibars, Sliders, Yoshimura TRC Ti 4-2 Slip Ons, Fender Eliminator, Zero Gravity SR Windscreen, Custom Heel Guards , Speedohealer V4, Pazzo Levers -soon to come: Flies out / PCV w/A/T kit and later 16T sprocket)1990 Honda Steed (Japan model same as Shadow)1993 Kawasaki Vulcan EN 500 (gone as I trade it in for the ZX-14)Santiago, Chile, South America
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ninja14
Pro
Posts: 1136
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posted March 02, 2008 10:46 PM
That's why it's called "slider" and not "impactor"
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2006 Turbo ZX-14.
2005 V-max 20th Anniv.
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psycho1122
Pro
Posts: 1608
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posted March 03, 2008 07:17 AM
Wild Hair Accesories has some new slider technology...
http://www.whaccessories.com/MetisseSlidersXPad.htm
I use the GSG Sliders on my 06' 10R and 00' 12R......EXCELLENT PRODUCTS!!
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You say PSYCHO like it's a BAD thing!!
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Sticks_n_Stones
Needs a job
Posts: 3930
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posted March 03, 2008 07:23 AM
Crap. Anyone make a slider that doesnt bolt right there? I gotta have sliders, but dont want to copy Reckless! Now I gotta decide.... pull them or leave them...
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'06 zx14
Muzzy M10/M14
PCIII w/ Muzzy map
Flies out K&N in!
bits n pieces...
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psycho1122
Pro
Posts: 1608
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posted March 03, 2008 07:29 AM
The X-Pad Technology I mentioned above is a "Shock Absorbing" Slider......
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You say PSYCHO like it's a BAD thing!!
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stevewfl
Moderator
Posts: 27920
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posted March 03, 2008 07:50 AM
I updated this old post with "BEWARE - NOTE LINE 4 WHEN "THINKING" A STRONGER BOLT IS BEST" because a few manufacturers boast "ultra-strength bolts", and long ago I warned people these bolts may break frames which totally defeats the purpose of a slider.
____________
2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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reckless
Novice Class
Posts: 60
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posted March 03, 2008 08:09 AM
Just an update for you all from this post from last year.
We now have a new 08 14 in the dark blue thanks to a very nice insurance company.
I have a set of Muzzy framesliders that I removed from the old bike before selling it. Other than being a little scuffed up were I had to use channel locks to get them off the old bike they are fine.
The frame sliders are in my tool box, I will not be putting them on the new bike!! I would rather go to my insurance company and as for new plastic than a new bike.
Sorry to hear about your bike kikonzx14, check the old posts here about bikes falling off sidestands, it was quite common when the 14 first came out.
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KikonZX14
Pro
Novice
Posts: 1813
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posted March 03, 2008 10:01 AM
NP reckless, I've already bought a pair of new mirrors on eBay, and will wait until some fairings are offered and replace the scuffed ones. In the meantime my Baby will "proudly" show her first "war scars". Maybe I should have taped the whole stupid thing and send it to MTV's Scarred...LOL!
WTHeck, such is life, at least now I know that I can lift her back to normal position, wearing helmet, jacket and gloves...... in a hot sunny day and sweating like a horse *grin*
Best Regards,
David
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Feel the need for SPEED2007 ZX-14 Black with Red Flames (Helibars, Sliders, Yoshimura TRC Ti 4-2 Slip Ons, Fender Eliminator, Zero Gravity SR Windscreen, Custom Heel Guards , Speedohealer V4, Pazzo Levers -soon to come: Flies out / PCV w/A/T kit and later 16T sprocket)1990 Honda Steed (Japan model same as Shadow)1993 Kawasaki Vulcan EN 500 (gone as I trade it in for the ZX-14)Santiago, Chile, South America
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countersteer
Needs a job
Didn't read the owners manual
Posts: 2207
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posted March 03, 2008 04:41 PM
whatever happened to that guy with the 'squidrails'? that thing looked like it was deathproof.
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Scott
Long Island, New York
2006 ZX-14, 2003 ZX-12R
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Flame On
Needs a life
Fuel Air & Spark
Posts: 17104
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posted March 03, 2008 07:56 PM
Race Railz by power stunt works looks like the way to go for 10 x s the bike protection over sliders or so they claim.
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77 RD 400
80 GS1000 GT
06 ZX14
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stevewfl
Moderator
Posts: 27920
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posted March 03, 2008 11:29 PM
added weight is the price to pay for race railz. they are popular with the stunt crowd around here
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2010 Concours14
'08 R1 YAMAHA
ZX14 gone!
CBR600RR track bike
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ZXfreak
Parking Attendant
Posts: 21
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posted March 04, 2008 02:30 PM
I will not be putting any on the 14, I see the point of having them for low speed drops, but I dont like the idea of putting all that weight on a little mounting point in case of a drop. The shock absorber ones above seem like a good idea, but that change the fact that if the slider slides into a pothole or something that catches on it, there goes your frame and engine, wheras without them most likely you just have fairing, bars, and lever damage.
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2007 Superduke
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