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BIKELAND > FORUMS > DRAGBIKE ZONE.com > Thread: MPS AUTO SHIFT PROBLEMS SHIFTING ON ZX12R NEW TOPIC NEW POLL POST REPLY
JSCARB2


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posted October 24, 2006 02:37 PM        
MPS AUTO SHIFT PROBLEMS SHIFTING ON ZX12R

i have a 2002 zx12 with a full mps airshifter and auto shift box, high pressure 20oz paintball bottle. i have this setup on a cbr900rr zx14 zx6r and the zx12 the zx12 sometimes shifts 1 to 2 then stays on the limiter. dan at mps has replaced the box, i have tried a box off the other bike and so on no luck. it has a lock-up clutch with all new fibers steels and springs and i am running a shinko so i dont think it is the clutch slipping or the tire spinning. i have tried everything from a 10,000 chip to a 12,200 chip for my shift points but it will not shift right!
any ideas?
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zxboy


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posted October 24, 2006 02:43 PM        
So If I understand you it's not shifting into 3rd ????
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JSCARB2


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posted October 24, 2006 02:47 PM        
yes sometimes it will not hit second but most of the time it is third the horn button works if i want to manual and if i hold it just 3/4 throttle it goes through the auto shift right. but at wide open it has hang ups. also the bike only has 40?? on it and i have hasd it since new so i dont think it is internal. some of the guys in va say they are having problems with the shinko's aired down spinning on the rim but i have no problem on the other bikes?
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WE DO POWDER COATING & CERAMIC COATING!
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zxboy


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posted October 24, 2006 04:13 PM        
Hate to say it but it may be the tranny......... Mine did the same thing. Didn't want to shift into 3rd all the time. Thought it was a problem with the auto-shift. The 12's have a weak circlip in the tranny that can wear out and make it hard to go into 3rd.. especially when air shifting. Had my tranny done (the works) by R+D and have not had a problem since.
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JSCARB2


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posted October 24, 2006 04:45 PM        
but why does the button work? or if I pull the lockup it foot shifts fine. does the placement of the bracket on the shifter matter or the length of the rod coming out of the shift cylinder to the bracket?
I AM PRETTY SURE IT IS NOT THE TRANNY BUT I COULD BE WRONG! 4700 MILES IS NOT THAT MUCH
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SOMETHINGS COMING DOWN ON THE BANKS!
2002 ZX-12R
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zrexpilot


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posted October 24, 2006 06:03 PM        
How do you have the shift cylinder mounted. I had one of those brackets and it pulled by the shift rod. It didnt work right. Missed a lot.
I moved the cylinder to the frame and it pulls by the shift lever now which gives it a lot more leverage, shift like butter now.
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JSCARB2


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posted October 24, 2006 06:14 PM        
i have the spencer cycles bracket it goes to the shift rod not the foot shifter, it is front to back not vertical


[img]http://www.mpsracing.com/images/products/Spencer/zx12rinstalled.jpgimg]
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OUTER BANKS NC
SHOP 252-473-5214
WE DO POWDER COATING & CERAMIC COATING!
SOMETHINGS COMING DOWN ON THE BANKS!
2002 ZX-12R
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1993 CBR900RR DONT BE FOOLED!
2006 BUSA LIMITED
2002 VTX1800C
1998 ZX-11D
1988 SUZUKI INTRUDER 700

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buddy


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posted October 24, 2006 07:14 PM        
I have a MPS shifter and it works well. I had some learning problems and sounds like you are experiencing some of my problems. First, don't put a chip any higher than 11.400 as the rpm limiter will not let the shifter reach it. I have mine set at 11,200 and it shifts every time. Second, it sounds like maybe it is shifting to 2nd gear and falling back to neutral. I don't know if that is what you meant by staying on the limiter. If that is what is happening, your second gear is probably worn. If not, maybe you need to adfust the kill time a little longer.
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JSCARB2


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posted October 24, 2006 07:19 PM        
quote:
I have a MPS shifter and it works well. I had some learning problems and sounds like you are experiencing some of my problems. First, don't put a chip any higher than 11.400 as the rpm limiter will not let the shifter reach it. I have mine set at 11,200 and it shifts every time. Second, it sounds like maybe it is shifting to 2nd gear and falling back to neutral. I don't know if that is what you meant by staying on the limiter. If that is what is happening, your second gear is probably worn. If not, maybe you need to adfust the kill time a little longer.
'i
in case you did not read i am running these on 4 bike have been for years, it is not the kill time or the chip as stated above i have tried everything from 10,000 series to 12,000 series. it is shifting first to second and never comews back down off the limiter. it is no going to a false neutral. i can back out of it and it will shift again.not trying to be a dick but did not sound like you read the original post well. thanks
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OUTER BANKS NC
SHOP 252-473-5214
WE DO POWDER COATING & CERAMIC COATING!
SOMETHINGS COMING DOWN ON THE BANKS!
2002 ZX-12R
2006 ZX-14
1993 CBR900RR DONT BE FOOLED!
2006 BUSA LIMITED
2002 VTX1800C
1998 ZX-11D
1988 SUZUKI INTRUDER 700

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buddy


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posted October 24, 2006 09:16 PM        Edited By: buddy on 24 Oct 2006 21:26
I didn't mean to patronize you. I only wanted to point out that MY bike, which is set up a lot like yours, hits the rev limiter at 11,500. I only wanted to point out that since MY bike CAN'T rev higher, putting a higher activating chip than 11,500 in the shifter will guarantee the failure. That is what you stated as a problem in the first post. If your bike can rev that high, I stand corrected.

Additionally, in the first post, the way I understood it, when it goes to second, it immediately goes to the rev limiter. That could be caused by clutch slippage, but you stated you had all new clutch parts, and besides, at that rpm, the clutch should be locked up and not slipping. I suggested that MAYBE it was actually in neutral, and in the rev limiter, instead of 2nd and in the rev limiter. I must have misinterpreted that it "immediately" went to the limiter. Maybe you meant it goes to second, and pulls through the gear, then goes into the limiter due to failing to automatically shift. There was room in the wording of the post for honest misunderstanding.

You asked for ideas. Apparently, by your post, you didn't like mine, so, sorry. Bye, bye.

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NOX


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posted October 24, 2006 09:37 PM        
You need to call Mark at R&D. Pretty soon it wont shift anything..........., trust me, I have my tranny in the box ready to ship......... You probably have bent shift shafts, and forks........, and with a 12, no telling what else, probably the clip is worn too.........
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JSCARB2


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posted October 25, 2006 06:46 AM        
but that does not explain why it button shifts fine and if i pull the lock-up i can foot shift it fine! i hate to pull the tranny apart for the auto shift box just not working right.
IF IT IS THE SHIFT FORKS OR SOMETHING IN THE TRANNY WOULD IT MESS UP ALL THE TIME?
i just had fast by gast do a tranny in my other bike i understand they go bad but dam the zx12 only has 4000 and some change on it

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madmike


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posted October 25, 2006 08:15 AM        
What pressure is going to the shifter? and what is your kill time set at? I would look at both of those... and nothing against SC but I have heard some people have had some weird stuff happen with that "style" of mounting bracket, everyone's not just his...

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JSCARB2


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posted October 25, 2006 09:54 AM        
i have tried the pressure from 120 -160 and have turned the kill all the way to min. and all the way to full nothing helps. i am begining to think it is the bracket myself bering that all the other bimes goes vertical to thew frame! i am going to check and see if i can move it without drilling the frame.
ANYONE HAVE PICS OF A AIRSHIFTER TO THE FRAME OR VERTICAL MOUNTED ON A ZX12R?

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750 turbo


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posted October 25, 2006 12:28 PM        
air cylinder

I had nothing but trouble drag racing my twelve nver wanted to shift right until i did away with the bracket that bolts to the water pump. The cure was mounting the cylinder vertical instead of horizontal. Mounted the cylinder to the shift lever not the rod. Grab ahold of the shift lever and then the rod itself you will see that it takes a lot more pressure to pull on the rod. Just a suggestion.

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JSCARB2


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posted October 25, 2006 03:19 PM        
quote:
I had nothing but trouble drag racing my twelve nver wanted to shift right until i did away with the bracket that bolts to the water pump. The cure was mounting the cylinder vertical instead of horizontal. Mounted the cylinder to the shift lever not the rod. Grab ahold of the shift lever and then the rod itself you will see that it takes a lot more pressure to pull on the rod. Just a suggestion.


that is what I am starting to think! all my other bikes and the bikes I have done for guys are vertical mounted and to the shifter not the rod. can you guys that have it like this post some pics or sends me some of how and where you went to the frame? I am assuming you drilled the frame but want to make sure. thanks

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NINJA12


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posted October 25, 2006 05:09 PM        
The reason it shifts on the button and not auto is because of the amount of time
there is pressure on the shift level. When you push the button you hold pressure even after the kill event. The auto shift just kills and apply pressure for that split fraction of a second.
If the kill and level pull are not timed exactly right you miss that gear.
Look at the digi-kill attempt for an attempt at getting the timing right.

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NOX


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posted October 25, 2006 05:38 PM        
I had less trouble with the vertical set up, I even made a pass with the bottle off,,,,,,,,,, only what was in a three foot line made 5 shifts........
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750 turbo


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posted October 25, 2006 06:48 PM        
shift problem

I had pictures of the setup with the cylinder bolted to the shift lever vertical, but if you look up from the shift lever to where the big bolt goes through the swingarm at the top of it measure up about two inches and reach in behind the frame and feel with your finger there is a cavity in the fram and i just drilled a small 1/4 inch hole through the center, if you decide to go that way i will give you the exact measurements. And also the distance back from the rubber on the shift lever. I did my 2 zx12 and they work perfect. Just a suggestion.

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zrexpilot


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posted October 25, 2006 08:18 PM        
quote:
i have the spencer cycles bracket it goes to the shift rod not the foot shifter, it is front to back not vertical


[img]http://www.mpsracing.com/images/products/Spencer/zx12rinstalled.jpgimg]



How did I know that. thats your problem, I guarantee it.
____________
'0412R
5.72@131mph
8.79@167mph (spinning)
Motor go Kaboom!
on some dope

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JSCARB2


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posted October 25, 2006 08:20 PM        
quote:
quote:
i have the spencer cycles bracket it goes to the shift rod not the foot shifter, it is front to back not vertical


[img]http://www.mpsracing.com/images/products/Spencer/zx12rinstalled.jpgimg]



How did I know that. thats your problem, I guarantee it.

i think you are right! i want to see the setups lie this so i can copy it

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NINJA12


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posted November 11, 2006 07:44 PM        
ttt

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BADBOYINDC


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posted November 13, 2006 06:01 AM        
I am having the same problem i just got this mps on my bike and at low rpms it will shift athigh rpms it wont shift
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RA12R


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posted November 13, 2006 07:16 PM        
With the MPS, you need the solenoid closer to the cylinder, even attached directly to the cylinder. Will make a big difference in the activation time lag of the cylinder.
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NOX


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posted November 14, 2006 06:51 AM        
I mount mine direct , works well..........

no bike will shift while spinning like hell.......
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