shiphteey
Needs a job
Posts: 2529
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posted May 03, 2013 03:32 AM
 Edited By: shiphteey on 3 May 2013 11:34
touching on that, this is the first year I'll be streeting my 12 at stock ride height with BSTS, new braided lines, new pads....done....simply better and safer.
Looking forward to this season's street sessions. I think the 12 handles ok stock ride height....even lowered with BSTs was....doable...but I have yet to flog it stock ride height and BSTs....a learning curve of early corner entries and re-corrections is coming, lol.
Plaer, something else to not overlook is setting up the suspension for your weight and riding style.
If you are heavier the front springs will need to be replaced, if you are lighter like me the front somewhat suffices but the rear is just too stiff and that spring needs a softer setup, which I will be looking to do in the future.
A.
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Gemini Motorcycles
Topping out everything from Ninja 250s to nitrous ZX-14s.
  
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Gunner
Needs a life
Posts: 5778
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posted May 03, 2013 11:21 PM
I've never had a problem being early on a corner with the 12R. When I use to try and swap between my 10R and 12R I was way early with the 10R all the time and late on the 12R when I was trying to swap back and forth all the time. I finally just decided the only safe thing was to only take the 12R when there wasn't any plans to do bunches of corners. It got left home more often than not which led to selling the 12R and making a huge mistake that I was lucky enough to correct before the guy I sold it to destroyed it. There's so many reasons to own a 12R over most any other thing else made. The 12R was a very special motorcycle to Kawasaki and until 7 years past it's production date ended did Kawasaki finally build a package that would spank the 12R. Because the Gen1 ZX14 wasn't the package until it's owner spent serious money on engine mods. Stock pictons for stock pistons the 12R made more power still at only 1199cc and the cylinder head was superior to the gen 1 ZX14. The 12R is still a worthy package in the hands of guys that's not afraid to build a bike the right way which happens to also be the expensive way. This $1000 Carrillo rods are cheap compared to the parts that need to be designed proto typed and manufactured If these new generation 998cc liter bikes can make in excess of 220 Hp to the rear there's no reason the 12R can't produce that and more if properly designed and built at it's current displacement. If it can be done at 1000cc I refuse to believe it can't be done at 1199 cc. It takes a bit more intelligence than just shoving a larger set of pistons up it's arse and expecting a miracle of Hp to befall one's self which is exactly what everyone has done up to now.
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There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
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dougmeyer
Needs a job
moderated
Posts: 2713
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posted May 16, 2013 10:11 AM
My Green 2000 12- Ohlins Shock, Muz Exh, PC3R (Custom Map), Muz clutch pak, HyperPro Damper, Braided lines, stock gearing, Pilot Sports, Motul 300V
I think this bike is PERFECT.
I grin big time every time I ride it. For perspective, I have ridden hundreds of bikes (that is NOT an exaggeration) N/A, Turboed, Supercharged, Sprayed, and combinations thereof; singles, twins, triples, four, and even a six or too and I just love how well it does everything and is still the fastest production bike ever sold! I'll not ever sell this bike.
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It's not that I think you're dumb, it's just that so much of what you know isn't true....
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Gunner
Needs a life
Posts: 5778
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posted May 17, 2013 11:26 PM
Edited By: Gunner on 18 May 2013 07:39
Lots of interesting things going on inside the original throttle bodies that only recently got noticed in my shop that I'll bet several people that had the inside track during the prototype days back in 99 knew about
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There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
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tuusinii
Pro
Posts: 1031
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posted May 20, 2013 01:49 AM
What do you mean - you discoverd the "lost power" of the prototypes?
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted May 20, 2013 02:42 PM
my muzzt ti put me +23hp it hauls major ass. i can not for the life of me think the coin put out on a different pipe will me say "dam i am glad i did that"
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted May 20, 2013 02:48 PM
first question i have is what year?
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Gunner
Needs a life
Posts: 5778
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posted May 20, 2013 06:06 PM
quote:
my muzzt ti put me +23hp it hauls major ass. i can not for the life of me think the coin put out on a different pipe will me say "dam i am glad i did that"
Hard to beat an Arata pipe on a 12R.. There's a reason Sal took the Muzzy pipe off Dale's bike that it already had and put on an Arata when he set all the records with a 1287 motor and it wasn't that he wanted to spend more money.
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There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted May 20, 2013 06:26 PM
well my friend i am only going as fast as i want to. i am not a keeping up with the joneses person or a record chaser. imagine how many times you spend your life savings to set a record... when i stroke my bike to 1300 i will put my brand new muzzy big tube pro pipe on.
i got it for 250 on clearence.
if someone ships me a arata pipe i will tune it for the same afr as the muzzy is running and dyno it on the same dyno and see if it tops 186hp. i will even lean it out and ritchen it up to give it a fair chance.
they are nice looking pipes. some say they do not mess up the way the bike runs like a muzzy. that means to me anyway it is more restrictive than the muzzy.
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted May 20, 2013 06:33 PM
plaer i bet you never thought this post you put up would end up this way...
so what year is it. what do you want to do with it. if just ride it i say keep it stock.
they are durable. i have 18000 on mine and it has a whole lot of passes.
if you are going to woop up on it i would think on the clutch basket like others said.
also do not worry much on getting a aftermarket air filter. do that last. use the money elseware till there is nothing to do.
get a stearing dampener. i have a scotts. i went down at the dragstrip from a tank slapper.
i have helibars on also. it sits alot better for me that way.
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dougmeyer
Needs a job
moderated
Posts: 2713
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posted May 21, 2013 10:57 AM
Here we go again.
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It's not that I think you're dumb, it's just that so much of what you know isn't true....
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Gunner
Needs a life
Posts: 5778
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posted May 21, 2013 09:37 PM
If you don't enjoy the ride step off old man.. Or do you have to keep pitchin the Muz Junk to continue drawing your pension from him? Facts are facts Sal took the Muzzy pipe off Dale's 12 and replaced it with an Arata and it owns the records with the Arata pipe. If you took every header Muzzy ever made and piled them up as tall as you can toss them they wouldn't add up to one Arata pipe starting with the R&D they put into every pipe and ending with the robot welds that are flawless inside and out on every pipe. Hell they're so nice it's a shame to run exhaust inside them.
What am I thinking I'm suppose to bow to your wisdom when in Rome right? And your wisdom says Muzzy or bust a nut!
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There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
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FlaminRoo
Novice Class
Posts: 76
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posted May 21, 2013 11:51 PM
Edited By: FlaminRoo on 22 May 2013 08:15
so Gunner, what rear wheel horsepower is this "Worlds Fastest" ZX12R making, ???
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted May 22, 2013 01:54 AM
that will be a secret.
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psycho1122
Pro
Posts: 1608
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posted May 22, 2013 05:52 AM
quote:
My Green 2000 12- Ohlins Shock, Muz Exh, PC3R (Custom Map), Muz clutch pak, HyperPro Damper, Braided lines, stock gearing, Pilot Sports, Motul 300V
I think this bike is PERFECT.
I grin big time every time I ride it. For perspective, I have ridden hundreds of bikes (that is NOT an exaggeration) N/A, Turboed, Supercharged, Sprayed, and combinations thereof; singles, twins, triples, four, and even a six or too and I just love how well it does everything and is still the fastest production bike ever sold! I'll not ever sell this bike.
I completely agree here Doug. We even did geometry measurements when my buddies were setting thier 1000's up for CCS Amaturer racing. They all looked at me astonished when we discovered that my 2000 12' was "perfect". Right down to swingarm angle. Of course, perfect by Lindemann Engineering standards.... (RIP Jim).
Other than the extra heft (which is not always detrimental), the bike is the perfect Do-All and does ALOT of this VERY well. Other than the Ohlins shock (mine is Custom build by Race Tech) Doug, our bikes have alot of the same bolt on's including the HyperPro Damper. 
Cheers to you!
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You say PSYCHO like it's a BAD thing!!
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psycho1122
Pro
Posts: 1608
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posted May 22, 2013 05:53 AM
quote:
Here we go again.
LOL!! No kidding.....
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You say PSYCHO like it's a BAD thing!!
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Gunner
Needs a life
Posts: 5778
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posted May 22, 2013 07:42 AM
quote:
that will be a secret.
Ask Sal at ACE what the power is. Since he don't tune with a Dyno and lets the performance of the motor speak for itself I don't think he knows the power level but anyone that can read knows how Sal tunes. Do the math if it's that important to know the power level. Do you race Dyno sheets or motorcycles? Since racing Dyno sheets is only good for sitting around Starbucks and bragging those numbers don't really matter to real racers only want a be racers. I posted the picture of the bike at the track wearing the header pipe I said it used. The records are old news to everyone and are without doubt legal records. I don't personally care if you use a Muzzy pipe but the thread was asking about what's the best stuff to use and in the header department the Arata is that part.
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There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
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dougmeyer
Needs a job
moderated
Posts: 2713
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posted May 22, 2013 09:05 AM
Ya kinda went off in the wrong direction, Gunn. I was referring to the Mysterious missin hp. that now resides in the TB's.
That being said,
It is quite believable (and likely) that the Arata combination on a particular bike will have different characteristics than if you put any other brand of pipe on the same bike. And, that would show on the meter. Is it the most power available? Maybe, maybe not. you won't know if you don't measure it in actual testing. It might very well be for that particular tine and combination. Still, it is not uncommon for certain combinations to feel faster, yet make less power.
One final comment though, If you can't measure it on the dyno, it doesn't exist. And, in back to back testing, if it isn't faster on the track, it doesn't matter what you think.
Your lack of knowlege regarding the value of actual dyno TESTING is pretty astounding.
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It's not that I think you're dumb, it's just that so much of what you know isn't true....
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supra5677
Pro
Posts: 1279
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posted May 22, 2013 10:23 AM
Mr. Meyer:
What is the effect on throttle body size and top speed?
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FlaminRoo
Novice Class
Posts: 76
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posted May 22, 2013 12:40 PM
yeah, what Doug said x2,
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dougmeyer
Needs a job
moderated
Posts: 2713
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posted May 22, 2013 01:19 PM
C'mon Supra, you know the answer to that....
Throttle body size may or may not be relevant. If the TB's flow enough air to allow the engine to burn enough fuel to deliver the maximum available HP for the combination, making them bigger won't help. In fact it may very well complicate low speed performance (but you asked about top speed so that's not a factor).
IF your combination of displacement, camshaft, compression and cylinder head flow has a greater peak power total flow requirement that is greater than the ability of the TB bore to flow, then it could be bigger and peak power should improve.
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It's not that I think you're dumb, it's just that so much of what you know isn't true....
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Gunner
Needs a life
Posts: 5778
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posted May 23, 2013 07:09 PM
My issue with the direction I went Dougie was when I wasn't posting on this site or any other you along with a couple more called me by name and accused me making post that you didn't agree with for one reason of another. I didn't post here for 5 years up to a little over a month back. I specifically ask Fish to unlock my screen name to address each of those that thought it was the in thing to do to be kicking someone under the bus wheels that can't even post in their own defense. I DON'T HIDE BEHIND ANY OTHER SCREEN NAME NOW OR EVER because I'm afraid for someone to know that I don't agree with them or the masses. SO next time you feel like calling someone else by name get some real proof besides someone posting " Bla, Bla Gunning for you " Yet another person that thinks anyone that has balls enough to disagree with him has to be me. I suppose that could be a compliment but it wasn't meant as one.
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There's no such thing as a motor with no more power to give only people with no more intelligence to get it
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dougmeyer
Needs a job
moderated
Posts: 2713
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posted May 23, 2013 07:40 PM
I have no beef with you Gunner. I'm all about the techy stuff, not the gossip.
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It's not that I think you're dumb, it's just that so much of what you know isn't true....
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supra5677
Pro
Posts: 1279
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posted May 23, 2013 08:40 PM
The zx10r and BMW s1000rr have larger throttle bodies
than the zx14r. Jim Gilnack said his bored out throttle
bodies on a stock 1352cc engine yielded 7 hp on dyno. Can
we assume that the throttle bodies on the zx14r are too small?
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Hibs
Expert Class
Posts: 127
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posted May 24, 2013 05:47 AM
quote:
I DON'T HIDE BEHIND ANY OTHER SCREEN NAME NOW OR EVER because I'm afraid for someone to know that I don't agree with them or the masses.
So what do you call all those times over on kawasakiworld.com where you created a fake username and started posting bullshit just to argue with people? You just couldn't handle the fact that you kept getting banned huh?
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