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BIKELAND > FORUMS > ZX12R ZONE.com > Thread: ZX12R B2 Won't Fire and Run NEW TOPIC NEW POLL POST REPLY
Black Gold ZX12R


Parking Attendant
Posts: 15
posted January 31, 2011 03:49 AM        Edited By: Black Gold ZX12R on 31 Jan 2011 22:05
ZX12R B2 Won't Fire and Run

After changing the battery the bike refuses to fire. Cranking speed is good. All dash board indications are normal i.e self check sequence completes, the fuel pump can be heard "zip zip" sound as it primes. Press the starter and engine turns but doesn't fire.
Kill switch on handle bar is in correct position (if operated whilst cranking immmediately cranking stops). Main 30A fuse OK, Fuel pump 15A fuse OK, battery was fully charged before trying and has been on charge (Accumate) between attempts. Fuel is no more than 3 weeks old and more than a gallon in the tank. Bike was running perfect before cold weather when it was parked in garage with Accumate connected was sluggish to turn over old battery was 2 years old so replaced now no firing even though turning over at correct speed. Thank you for your help

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tuusinii


Pro
Posts: 1015
posted January 31, 2011 04:04 PM        
Try with the OLD- battery if it worked. Or first check the voltage when cranking. With new battery chould be near 10V and about 12.7 volts when not cranking. Maybe You got a bad battery. Recheck that You put all the wires in You took out. And just to be sure - but some extra fuel in...
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psycho1122


Pro
Posts: 1599
posted February 03, 2011 09:58 PM        
After checking for 'correct" battery power, unplug the large white connector on the side of the battery tray behind the cover. When you plug it back in, you will here the guage cluster reset. It should fire after that if you don't have a bad fuse or something else disconnected somewherere.
____________
You say PSYCHO like it's a BAD thing!!

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Black Gold ZX12R


Parking Attendant
Posts: 15
posted March 10, 2011 05:44 AM        
still no joy have tried all the above any other ideas?
Anyone else had the same problem?
Thanks

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tuusinii


Pro
Posts: 1015
posted March 11, 2011 01:40 AM        
Did You try with jumper battery? Does the Fuel Injection light blink? Is the neutral light on? Don't pull the clutch.
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Black Gold ZX12R


Parking Attendant
Posts: 15
posted March 11, 2011 02:16 AM        
Yes tried jumper lead
Yes FI light blinks when cranking
Neutral light is on
Not pulling clutch when trying to start.

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tuusinii


Pro
Posts: 1015
posted March 11, 2011 03:21 AM        
That is Your problem. Have You checked the foult codes from ECU? You may not get them but one reason to have sympton like that is Your Gear position sensor. Also ignition switch. But when thinking if it is gear position sensor it shouldn't prime the fuel... But check Your fault codes and it will work. Have You disconnected cam sensor? It's on the other side of battery but can be easily forgetted if removed...
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Black Gold ZX12R


Parking Attendant
Posts: 15
posted March 12, 2011 03:12 AM        
Thanks I'll try again. What does the Cam sensor connector/cable look like as I don't remember disconnecting any thing else beside the large white multiplug and small blk/yell lead plug on this side of the battery, the -ve connection to the start solenoid screw terminal and finally the +ve cable from the battery itself? Is it easy to disconnect this cam sensor?
I'll recheck the gear sensor but the Neutral light is on and goes off when gears are selected.

Once again thanks for the help and if any one else has any other ideas please keep them coming it would be nice to ride the bike now teh nice weather is coming

Safe riding to you all

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tuusinii


Pro
Posts: 1015
posted March 13, 2011 03:21 AM        
Well the CAM sensor is on the opposite side but just a thought what could be culprit... Did You do anything else as changing the battery? But if it is blinking the FI-light You should be able to pull the codes and read the error. It will probably give You an idea what is wrong. Instruction for reading the errors can be found here somewhere or from the service manual. Basically just ground one loose wire near the ECU and read the codes...
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Black Gold ZX12R


Parking Attendant
Posts: 15
posted March 19, 2011 06:04 PM        
Once again thanks for the advice. Is there any clear instructions or procedures on how to obtain the codes and what they mean. Only have PDF file of service book and that isn't mentioned.

No the only thing I did was change the battery. Bike was working perfect 3 weeks earlier just slugggish to turn over in January and as battery was two years old change it, result fast turn over but not firing

Many thanks

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Black Gold ZX12R


Parking Attendant
Posts: 15
posted March 19, 2011 08:01 PM        
Have found more info on fault codes so will give it a go and let you know
Thanks again

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tuusinii


Pro
Posts: 1015
posted March 21, 2011 10:04 PM        
Do the testing so that You first try to start it ( so FI light flashes) and the pull the codes. It's the one loose wire on right side near ECU. Remove the trunk and You'll see. Then the FI light starts to flash - you have to count them up and then we'll know more.
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NINJA12


Needs a job
Posts: 3310
posted March 23, 2011 12:06 AM        
If you have a power commander unhook it and try again.
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Black Gold ZX12R


Parking Attendant
Posts: 15
posted May 03, 2011 06:14 PM        
Thanks for all the sugguestions. After being away for two weeks with work and leaving it in the garage on the battery trickle charger, I went in the gargae to do something else stuck the key in just in blind hope I thought I would try it one more time and it started 1st time. That was two weeks ago and has started everytime since. So no idea what has changed or why it wouldn't start before as it has been on charge since the new battery was fitted in January and due to work that has been weeks between me trying to start it. So absolutely no idea why it's now starting but at least it's working with the good weather now here.

Safe riding to you all an donce again THANKS.

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Black Gold ZX12R


Parking Attendant
Posts: 15
posted October 19, 2011 03:04 AM        
BAD NEWS EVERYONE THE PROBLEM HAS RETURNED
Have starting problem with ZX12R B2 2005. Last December sluggish to turn over so battery replaced in January cranking at a good speed but engine won't fire. Cutting a long story short after two months of checking various items and due to work it was left in the garage untouched on trickle charge and after a fortnight tried starting and started first time (see thread above) 7 months without any problems until this weekend running fine on Friday went to start it Tuesday again cranking but won't fire up. Outside temperature has dropped to near 3 degrees which is what it did last year when the problem first started. Could it be ambient temperature related? Battery is a VARTA 100A cold crank would a Yuasa 200A cold crank be better? What batteries are you all using?
Any help gratefully received.
THANKS

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Paul2281


Expert Class
Posts: 147
posted October 19, 2011 07:14 AM        
Since it started after being away for 2 weeks,maybe the plugs were gas fouled and dried out in those 2 weeks or something like that....Try a new set of plugs and check for spark while you`re there too.....If it has spark then there is another problem somewhere with the ECU or something.....Putting too much fuel in maybe.....JMO....
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Black Gold ZX12R


Parking Attendant
Posts: 15
posted October 20, 2011 04:00 AM        
Paul thanks for the advice but it has run for 7 months with no problem and only now decided not to start when the temperature has dropped. Fuel is not stale only being in the tank for three days it has started first time every time in the 7 months Kill switches, side stand, clutch switches all work, fuel pump and be heard whirling up on switch on all dash self checks are completed and there has been no FI light on whilst riding

Does any know is the an outside temperature sensor on the bike and if so where? I know about the air intake in the air box but that is measuring air flow when the bike is moving I'm wondering if there is an ambient temperature sensor that has decided it's too cold to start?

FURTHER HELP NEEDED PLEASE

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Michaels12


Novice Class
Posts: 43
posted October 22, 2011 05:58 AM        
too cold to start?
nope...guaranteed.
you need to read the maual on how to enter the dealer mode for FI code display.
Ill see if I can copy and paste that section.

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Michaels12


Novice Class
Posts: 43
posted October 22, 2011 06:03 AM        
•Remove the strage box (see Frame chapter) and pull the
self-diagnosis indicator terminal [G]. •Turn on the ignition switch. •Connect an auxiliary a lead [E] for grounding to the selfdiagnosis
indicator terminals. •Enter the self-diagnosis dealer mode 1 by grounding
[A] the self-diagnosis indicator terminal to the ground
for more than 2 seconds [C], and then keep it grounded
continuously [D].
○Count the blinks of the LED light to read the service code.
•Enter the self-diagnosis dealer mode 2 by repeat opening
and grounding [A] the lead more than five times [F]
within 2 seconds [C] after the lead is first grounded, and
then keep it grounded continuously [D] for more than 2
seconds.
○Count the blinks of the LED light to read the service code

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Michaels12


Novice Class
Posts: 43
posted October 22, 2011 06:12 AM        
Inlet Air Temperature
Ta = – 47°C ∼ + 178°C

This is the acceptable temp range for " ok to run"

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Michaels12


Novice Class
Posts: 43
posted October 22, 2011 06:14 AM        
11 Throttle sensor (ZX1200-B1/B2), main throttle sensor
(ZX1200-B3), malfunction, wiring open or short
12 Inlet air pressure sensor malfunction, wiring open or
short
13 Inlet air temperature sensor malfunction, wiring open
or short
14 Water temperature sensor malfunction, wiring open or
short
15 Atmospheric pressure sensor malfunction, wiring open
or short
21 Crankshaft sensor malfunction, wiring open or short
23 Camshaft position sensor malfunction, wiring open or
short
24 Speed sensor malfunction, wiring open or short
25 Gear position switch malfunction, wiring open or short
31 Vehicle-down sensor, malfunction, wiring open or short
32 Subthrottle sensor malfunction, wiring open or short
35 Immobilizer amplifier malfunction
36 Blank key detection
41 Injector #1 malfunction, wiring open or short
42 Injector #2 malfunction, wiring open or short
43 Injector #3 malfunction, wiring open or short
44 Injector #4 malfunction, wiring open or short

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Michaels12


Novice Class
Posts: 43
posted October 22, 2011 06:15 AM        
45 Fuel pump relay wiring open
46 Fuel pump relay stuck ON
51 Ignition coil #1 malfunction, wiring open or short
52 Ignition coil #2 malfunction, wiring open or short
53 Ignition coil #3 malfunction, wiring open or short
54 Ignition coil #4 malfunction, wiring open or short
62 Subthrottle valve actuator malfunction, wiring open or
short

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Michaels12


Novice Class
Posts: 43
posted October 22, 2011 06:26 AM        
This is hard to read but its the computers version of the copy paste...this is more or less what the ecu does in the event of failure by the listed service code.....
11
Throttle
Sensor
(ZX1200
-B1/B2),
Main
Throttle
Sensor
(ZX1200-B3)
ZX1200-B1/B2:
Throttle Valve Opening
Angle θ = 6.5° ∼ + 86.5°
ZX1200-B3:
Main Throttle Sensor Output
Voltage
0.2 ∼ 4.8 V
If the throttle sensor system fails (the signal
is out of the usable range, wiring short or
open), the ECU locks ignition timing into the
ignition timing at closed throttle position and
sets the DFI in the D-J method.
Also, the throttle sensor system and inlet air
pressure fails, the ECU locks ignition timing
into the ignition timing at closed throttle
position and sets the DFI in the α-N method.
12
Inlet Air
Pressure
Sensor
Inlet Air Pressure (absolute)
Pv = 100 mmHg ∼ 900 mmHg
If the inlet air pressure sensor system fails
(the signal Pv is out of the usable range,
wiring short or open), the ECU sets the DFI
in the α - N method (1).
13
Inlet Air
Temperature
Sensor
Inlet Air Temperature
Ta = – 47°C ∼ + 178°C
If the inlet air temperature sensor fails (the
signal is out of the usable range, wiring
short or open), the ECU sets Ta at 45°C.
14
Water
Temperature
Sensor
Water Temperature
Tw = – 30C° ∼ + 120°C
If the water temperature sensor system fails
(the signal is out of the usable range, wiring
short or open), the ECU sets Tw at 86°C.
15
Atmospheric
Pressure
Sensor
Absolute Atmospheric
Pressure
Pa = 100 mmHg ∼ 900 mmHg
If the atmospheric pressure sensor system
fails (the signal is out of the usable range,
wiring short or open), the ECU sets Pa
at 760 mmHg (the standard atmospheric
pressure).
21 Crankshaft
Sensor
Crankshaft sensor must send
signals (output voltage) 8
continuously to the ECU.
If crankshaft sensor generates less than 8
or more signals, the engine stops by itself.
23
Camshaft
Position
Sensor
Camshaft position sensor
must send one signal (output
signal) to the ECU at the two
cranking
If the camshaft position sensor system fails
(the signal is missing, wiring short or open),
the ECU continues to ignite cylinders in
the same sequence following the last good
signal.
24 Speed
Sensor
The output voltage of the
rectangular wave:
Low Level: 1 V to 0
High Level: 4 V to 5 V
If the speed sensor system fails (no
conductivity, wiring short or open),
revolution limiter begin to start before
getting to the specified speed.
25
Gear
Position
Switch
Gear Position Switch
ON = Ground
OFF = 5 V or more (neutral),
5 V or less
If the gear position switch system fails (the
signal is out of the usable range, wiring
short or open), the ECU locks in 6th gear
position.
31
Vehicle
-down
Sensor
Vehicle-down Sensor Output
Voltage (signal)
Vd = 0.4 V ∼ 4.4 V
If the vehicle-down sensor system has
failures (the output voltage Vd is out of
the usable range, wiring short or open),
the ECU shuts off the fuel pump, the fuel
injectors and the ignition system

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tuusinii


Pro
Posts: 1015
posted October 23, 2011 03:37 PM        
One thing came in to mind is that check the TPS voltage and resistance. TPS could be broken so it works in warm and not when it gets colder. Also may not trigger ECU foult. The voltage should be about 1.08V. There is also resistance figures in the service manual but don't remember them right now. Also check the voltage when crancking - shoulb be close to 10V. If much lower the battery is toast.
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Black Gold ZX12R


Parking Attendant
Posts: 15
posted September 04, 2012 02:18 AM        
HI EVRYONE AGAIN

UPDATE ON ABOVE PROBLEM:-

Bike refused to start all over the winter and suddenly fired up in March 2012 (for those who understand BST and GMT it stopped the weekend the clocks went to GMT and started the weekend they went forward to BST so 5 months of unable to use it) Since then it has fired up every day (same battery plugs etc ) with no problem with the battery on trickle charge every night perfect runs well doesn't mis-fire or cough can't fault it. Have been away for three weeks holiday and now refuses top start again!!!!! Cranks over, fuel pump and relays all can be heard but just won't fire?

Could it be yet another battery this makes the third in four years (and considering for 9 months of that it hasn't started not good) Does anyone else have this problem or have to change batteries so regularly?

ONCE AGAIN MANY THANKS IN ADVANCE FOR ANY HELP OR SUGGUESTIONS

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