2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted November 16, 2009 07:25 PM
i agree the kiss method keep it simple stupid is check all the plugs as best as you can. vic has done his homework to the point i forgot what we talked about a while ago. it would be cool to get the bike out here and trouble shoot the sensor with mine then go to the drag strip. I WANT A 9.39 et friday night dam it.
  
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kaw12
Expert Class
Posts: 172
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posted November 16, 2009 07:27 PM
i need the speed of light
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted November 16, 2009 07:30 PM
lots of nos may do it. just hold on.
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KZScott
Needs a life
high on speed
Posts: 7235
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posted November 16, 2009 07:36 PM
makes the injectors fire when you chop the throttle and gives you rpm
my Innovate stuff works great....
i found that the stock gaskets and the muzzy pipe werent a great fit. the OD of the muzzy pipe was smaller where it bolts on than the stock pipe so its easy to be off center. coupled with the fact the ID is bigger for better flow, it can be hard to get a new gasket to be ligned up perfect. i flattened out 2 gaskets with a hammer(gently) and used them that way, its easier to get them ligned up as they get "fatter" when they are flat. the Hindle is a much tighter fit in the head and ligns up very well. if your collector leaks... im not sure for a cheap way as silicone is supposed to be bad for sensors. that being said i use ultra copper on exh gaskets, but run the bike quite awhile to burn any off before putting the sensor back in. hard drives you really want to bake the extra off. brazing or welding would work if you dont have to take it apart again...
your excellent ground... thats still on the side of the frame right? mine goes to the battery
____________
01 ZX-12R 8.84 @ 156.3 no bars, DOT tires. Pump Gas, NA.... turbo 8.47 @ 164.
00 ZX-12R 8.62 @ 165.2 no bars, slicks, Pump Gas, 55 shot.... turbo 8.32 @173
00 ZX-12R Fastest NA Kawasaki in the world 1: 222.046 1.5: 226.390 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R street turbo 1: 227.9 1.5: 234.1 Loring AFB
00 ZX-12R LSR turbo 1: 263.1 1.5: 266.5 Loring AFB Worlds fastest ZX-12R
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kaw12
Expert Class
Posts: 172
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posted November 16, 2009 07:40 PM
[im not sure for a cheap way as silicone is supposed to be bad for sensors. that being said i use ultra copper on exh gaskets, but run the bike quite awhile to burn any off before putting the sensor back in. hard drives you really want to bake the extra off. brazing or welding would work if you dont have to take it apart again...
your excellent ground... thats still on the side of the frame right? mine goes to the battery
just wrapp your pipe in exhaust wrap. and i got my datalogger hooked straight to the battery also.
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted November 16, 2009 07:42 PM
mine goes directly to the fuse box and the ground is on the frame under the cap nut that the map sensor mount stud uses on left side.
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kaw12
Expert Class
Posts: 172
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posted November 16, 2009 08:08 PM
i think the builders of the bikes get advanced retired race champions to run the bike to tell them how much or how much less fuel or timing the bike. the champs should know they been riding and racing and been around superbikes for ever.. you know you cant tell me with what experience you have from reading the sensor gauge now you know what the bike is doing when it drops 10 a/f or spikes uup 15+ it stumbles or fall flat. i would think they dont even log there bike. but i reserve the right to be way off track here. i mean those japs got that huge track and superior racers to run them they know exactly how to tell the tecs how the bike is running.. also what about the windtunnels they use.. what dyno is going to do that? lol i kill my self with the way i think.
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Whimp
Parking Attendant
Posts: 26
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posted November 16, 2009 08:13 PM
I doubt that its a exhaust leak, I have a stepped Hindle system on my bike and I have almost the same problem at the same TPS setting. At least in my case, it doesn't seem to be a logging problem. When mine goes lean, you can feel the motor start to lay down. just a small change in throttle position,(+ or- 1 percent) and it snaps out of it. With any luck, i'll hole a piston and have to install a bore kit! Duane
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kaw12
Expert Class
Posts: 172
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posted November 16, 2009 08:29 PM
that what mine does, it falls fat at to enriched and stumbles/misses at high lean. only happens at between 6-8% throttle open in any gear.except the highergears i think..
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kaw12
Expert Class
Posts: 172
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posted November 16, 2009 08:32 PM
 Edited By: kaw12 on 17 Nov 2009 04:35
quote:
I doubt that its a exhaust leak, I have a stepped Hindle system on my bike and I have almost the same problem at the same TPS setting. At least in my case, it doesn't seem to be a logging problem. When mine goes lean, you can feel the motor start to lay down. just a small change in throttle position,(+ or- 1 percent) and it snaps out of it. With any luck, i'll hole a piston and have to install a bore kit! Duane
thats what mine does, it falls fat at to enriched and stumbles/misses at high lean. only happens at between 6-8% throttle open in any gear.except the highergears i think.. but i will conquer the prob. oh but like i said my voltage was fluctuating and dropping and killed my batt. after i learned the stator was fried. and the spike didnt start until those things happend.
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twista
Zone Head
" Get up, and Stay up ! "
Posts: 797
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posted November 16, 2009 09:17 PM
honestly dont think i will make it this weekend,, gotta get a battery,, and then use the solder connectors and see where im at,, after that its on to the sensor,, i will keep you up to speed,, your not that far,, might have to load her up and take a rode trip.. hang tight,, good luck at the strip! Vic
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" When in Doubt, There is no Doubt !"
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kaw12
Expert Class
Posts: 172
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posted November 17, 2009 08:10 AM
you think a walmart battery would hold up? or would it explode from the G=FORCE....
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shiggsy
Expert Class
Posts: 128
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posted November 18, 2009 04:46 AM
Kaw12 and Whimp
Spotted your 7% throttle issues, I had the same thing. Take a look at this:
http://www.bikeland.org/board/viewthread.php?FID=1&TID=38561&pagenumber=1
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kaw12
Expert Class
Posts: 172
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posted November 18, 2009 07:54 AM
Edited By: kaw12 on 18 Nov 2009 16:16
quote:
Kaw12 and Whimp
Spotted your 7% throttle issues, I had the same thing. Take a look at this:
http://www.bikeland.org/board/viewthread.php?FID=1&TID=38561&pagenumber=1
so your saying i need to readjust my TPS? hmmmmm??
could a very low voltage battery cause this spike in this area?
does adjusting the idle screw change the value of the tps?
and how do you know when your tps is set optim. if not factory setting?
thats goood info shiggsy! thanks for sharing!
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shiggsy
Expert Class
Posts: 128
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posted November 18, 2009 12:08 PM
Edited By: shiggsy on 18 Nov 2009 20:09
quote:
so your saying i need to readjust my TPS? hmmmmm??
could a very low voltage battery cause this spike in this area?
does adjusting the idle screw change the value of the tps?
and how do you know when your tps is set optim. if not factory setting?
thats goood info shiggsy! thanks for sharing!
Thats ok but your probably not going to like the way this develops. I had thought that this was just an issue with just my bike as I have never seen anyone else raise this issue. I did raise the TPS and I now run it around 1.163 when measured at the sensor, quite a bit above stock. (I actually set the TPS from the reading through Datalogger voltage and set it at 1.170 so I have a round value to use as 0%. 1.170 at the Datalogger equates to 1.163 when measured at the TPS sensor with my multimeter).
What I did shortly after the above was fit an AFR sensor to each pipe. On stock settings that showed me cyls #2 and #3 were pretty similar, but #1 was rich below 7% and #4 was lean above 7%, which explains the chart you see on the other thread when measured with one just sensor.
Raising the TPS to 1.163 leans out the areas below 7% and richens up the areas above #4 lessening the sudden switch between rich and lean. I was then able to do a map for each cylinder.
Again this was what I found on my bike so I don't know if others will be the same so I wouldn't advocate anyone doing this without being able to monitor it. I also have EGT sensors on each pipe so I have been able to monitor the heat output as well. ( I have seen 800 degc on stock settings and I believe 750 is the safe maximum).
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twista
Zone Head
" Get up, and Stay up ! "
Posts: 797
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posted November 18, 2009 01:48 PM
Hmmm,, Drp on the kawasaki board said i should try the 1.16 low voltage setup,, mine is reading 1.02 and have the value @0% set at 1.03 to ensure 0% (multimerter) could that be any of my problem,, or is that just TPS and has nothing to do with the spike or what ever you refered to it as? check the PM on the other board Shiggs. thanx Vic
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" When in Doubt, There is no Doubt !"
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted November 18, 2009 02:54 PM
vic i think you and shig have two different issues. and the fault while it goes off the chart and the bike is still running properly has to point to something with the wego reading.
shig did you ever get your line better?
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shiggsy
Expert Class
Posts: 128
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posted November 18, 2009 03:42 PM
quote:
.
shig did you ever get your line better?
Ever since I moved the TPS up high. She's running great.
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted November 18, 2009 03:58 PM
i am glad you got it better. it seems that vic has a bike that runs correctly even while the o2 sensor says off the chart lean.
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Whimp
Parking Attendant
Posts: 26
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posted November 18, 2009 09:38 PM
Thanks Shiggsy. Now this is starting to make some sense. Does #4 still run lean(how much leaner) compared to #1? And, what are you using for a A/F target for touring? (I have been tuning A/F for the 14 to 14.5 area on my 01, but now i'm not so sure that it may be too lean to be safe.) Thanks again for the info, as soon as the weather warms up, i'll get out and play with the TPS setting. Duane
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shiggsy
Expert Class
Posts: 128
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posted November 19, 2009 05:54 AM
I'll have a dig around tonight see if I can find the charts and post them up.
I have 14 - 14.5 AFR but only in a very narrow band, around 2250 - 2500 rpm. Above that it will probably turn the inside of your exhaust pipe white.
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2000redrocket
Pro
Posts: 1662
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posted November 27, 2009 03:42 PM
so vic how is it going?
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